Pata with single-edged blade

Kubur · 20th August 2016, 04:45 PM

Hi,
I have seen a lot of blades like this on Firangi.
Just Google and you will see.
Now I'm not an expert and I don't know where these blades come from...
But I bet that they are Indians...
Best,
Kubur

mariusgmioc · 20th August 2016, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

Hi,
I have seen a lot of blades like this on Firangi.
Just Google and you will see.
Now I'm not an expert and I don't know where these blades come from...
But I bet that they are Indians...
Best,
Kubur

Hello Kubur,

Firangi were in their majority fit with European blades, and those that weren't, have Indian immitations of European blades.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firangi_(sword)

In your example it seems to be an Indian immitation of an European blade, but for a more educated guess, more photos would be necessary.

Cthulhu · 21st August 2016, 10:31 PM

Very nice. I really like the flower rivets securing the blade, and the helical pattern on the grip.

And up until now I was unaware that single-edged pata existed. Always nice to see something unusual.

Jens Nordlunde · 22nd August 2016, 09:39 PM

Thank you for showing, it is quite interesting - as I too have never seen an one edged blade on a pata - there are likely to be others, but it must be considered very rare.
Should the blade be European, I am sure Jim will tell us from where it is - just give him a little time, as he is on Route 66 :-).

Jerseyman · 10th September 2016, 09:24 PM

Thank you for the input folks.

In the hand it does seem to be a european blade - very consistent in construction. But of course difficult to attribute as there are no markings.

I actually have pictures of another pata which seem to show a single-edge blade, but I'm afraid I can't show them as they're from a sale item on a dealer's page.

Once the sale is made I shall post them for comment.

Thanks again.

Jim McDougall · 14th September 2016, 12:27 AM

Hi Jens, yes we are still on '66' plotting our escape from blazing Arizona heat, in the new Bookmobile!!!

As far as I can say, this blade looks Solingen, but agree, hard to say more without handling or marks etc. Many Solingen blades were 'blanks' and shipped en masse to foreign markets. Such blades it does not seem were widely copied by Indian makers as they were so available it did not seem necessary.

I would point out that usually the single edged blades are referred to as backswords and double edged broadswords. However in earlier times into the 19th, the term broadsword was often used indiscriminately .
Solingen did not produce double edged blades for Scotland after 1745, but they did produce these kinds of single edged blades for British cavalry swords in the latter 18th c.

With the pata, just as with the khanda, the firangi blades would well have been used as available of course. In my opinion, the style of use of the pata would have typically favored the DE blade, and mounting one with this kind of blade simply a matter of availability.

As always I would defer on those observations to those here far better versed in these arms and their use. In any case, very nice looking pata!

20th August 2016, 04:45 PM	#1
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Hi, I have seen a lot of blades like this on Firangi. Just Google and you will see. Now I'm not an expert and I don't know where these blades come from... But I bet that they are Indians... Best, Kubur Attached Images

21st August 2016, 10:31 PM	#3
Cthulhu Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Central Valley, California Posts: 46	Very nice. I really like the flower rivets securing the blade, and the helical pattern on the grip. And up until now I was unaware that single-edged pata existed. Always nice to see something unusual.

22nd August 2016, 09:39 PM	#4
Jens Nordlunde Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 2,718	Thank you for showing, it is quite interesting - as I too have never seen an one edged blade on a pata - there are likely to be others, but it must be considered very rare. Should the blade be European, I am sure Jim will tell us from where it is - just give him a little time, as he is on Route 66 :-).

10th September 2016, 09:24 PM	#5
Jerseyman Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 97	Thank you for the input folks. In the hand it does seem to be a european blade - very consistent in construction. But of course difficult to attribute as there are no markings. I actually have pictures of another pata which seem to show a single-edge blade, but I'm afraid I can't show them as they're from a sale item on a dealer's page. Once the sale is made I shall post them for comment. Thanks again.

14th September 2016, 12:27 AM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,192	Hi Jens, yes we are still on '66' plotting our escape from blazing Arizona heat, in the new Bookmobile!!! As far as I can say, this blade looks Solingen, but agree, hard to say more without handling or marks etc. Many Solingen blades were 'blanks' and shipped en masse to foreign markets. Such blades it does not seem were widely copied by Indian makers as they were so available it did not seem necessary. I would point out that usually the single edged blades are referred to as backswords and double edged broadswords. However in earlier times into the 19th, the term broadsword was often used indiscriminately . Solingen did not produce double edged blades for Scotland after 1745, but they did produce these kinds of single edged blades for British cavalry swords in the latter 18th c. With the pata, just as with the khanda, the firangi blades would well have been used as available of course. In my opinion, the style of use of the pata would have typically favored the DE blade, and mounting one with this kind of blade simply a matter of availability. As always I would defer on those observations to those here far better versed in these arms and their use. In any case, very nice looking pata!