British Naval Officer's Blue & Gilt Dirk

Jim McDougall · 18th June 2016, 05:50 PM

As always, Cathey posts fascinating examples that promote great discussions, and this one has been outstanding, not just for the intriguing subject matter, but the teamwork in sharing and observing details.

The Masonic theme in weaponry has been a constant fascination for many years, but often somewhat overlooked. In this case, the Masonic symbols placed in the motif of this dirk are not only obvious but compelling .

It often amazes me at just how thoroughly Freemasonry has permeated historic figures and events as well as the cultures of their times. Presently we are travelling through the Southwest, and even in these 'Wild West' cow towns the Masonic mystique prevailed. Coincidentally I was just researching some Masonic swords in a small museum in one in Arizona, where the primary focus was of course gunfighters and such history related to the OK Corral.
Here, along with the fabled six shooters, were a number of clearly Masonic swords, belonging to prominent figures in the town (not the gunfighters of course

.

Returning to Nelson and the Dirk in discussion. It is important to remember that Freemasonry was of course prevalent in military context as typically officers were of the gentry or varying levels of peerage. This being the case, naturally many, if not most, were highly involved in Masonic activity.
I suspect that in many cases, Masonic allegiance was predominant as there were certainly indistinct ties between members of lodges in France, and Great Britain.

Regarding Masonic related decoration and styling, it seems that in the neo classic styles in many edged weapons of the latter 18th century may have had even more subtle nuance, for example the 'five ball hilt' type of officers spadroon of 1780 +. These apparently evolved in England, but later, in a remarkable instance, were adopted in France as similar hilts termed as l'Anglaise.
In research many years ago, I thought that perhaps the 'balls' or 'beads' incorporated in the hilt elements may have had numeric significance, particularly in a Masonic sense with the number 5 . In France others had sometimes 7, but again, symbolism?
These ideas were inconclusive, and even Robson discounted the idea, thinking the decoration was simply aesthetic.
Still, as more Masonic themes become apparent, I still wonder.

Richard G · 23rd June 2016, 04:38 PM

Probably need a Mason to answer this one, but bearing in mind their reputation for secrecy, would this be a Masonic dagger, possibly belonging to a Lodge, for use in Masonic rituals, or would it be the dagger of a Naval Officer who was a Mason, and didn't care who knew it?
Regards
Richard

Will M · 18th July 2016, 06:32 PM

Richard I believe this dagger/dirk would have been used by a navy officer. The blade etching would not normally be seen except if drawn for use. Masons took pride in who they were and didn't hide the fact of who they were.
Many politicians, lawyers, etc. were masons, even US presidents.
I have many framed mason documents of my grandfathers including when he was Grand Superintendent of Toronto East Disttrict #8.

Helleri · 19th July 2016, 09:50 AM

What animal is the metal part of the grip mean to resemble? Also the side ring of the guard (maybe both of them?) has some sort of animal or symbol as well but I can't figure on what it is.

Richard G · 20th July 2016, 01:14 PM

Will, looking at this again, I'm still not sure. I can't see any naval connection other than the style of the dirk itself. I wonder if it is a masonic dirk, plain and simple'
Helleri, the pommel is supposed to be a lions head. This sort of 'upper half only head' is normal for this type of dirk.
Regards
Richard

Jim McDougall · 20th July 2016, 08:07 PM

Guys, thank you for bringing this thread back!
Actually the notion that this is a naval officers dirk was probably simply because of the well established use of them in that context.
The animal head is indeed intended to be a lion head, in this configuration it corresponds to British infantry officers sabre hilts (M1803) and other military and naval hilts of the Georgian period.

Looking further into this, it would seem that this is most likely a dirk made specifically for a Freemason, and probably of the Order of Knights Templar.
While checking references on Freemasonry, in this case which are on the American aspects, in many if not most cases, the allegory and symbolism used in Freemasonry transcends nationality and other denominators.

From "Material Culture of the American Freemasons" (John D. Hamilton, 1994, p159): 'Knights Templar Dirk"
"...both real and false dirks were worn attached to a regalia baldric or sash as an insignia of the Templar Order. Real dirks were prescribed for regalia worn by Knights Templar only in certain commanderies".

With the numerous symbols on this blade, it would seem perhaps that either it was intended for an individual with achievements in a number of degrees or associations in various rites or steps. In most cases, there is a wide spectrum of perceptions held toward these symbols. For non Freemasons such as myself, it is often dangerous to try to offer meanings and definitive assessments of these. The very secretive nature of Masonry has lead to prolific writings and material which can mostly be regarded as speculative.

The grips on the hilt in ivory for example, have the familiar Palladian arch, which while an architectural feature of the Renaissance, and from a famed architect and Mason, also appeared in Georgian and Federal designs in other than Masonic cases.
The rest of the symbols on the blade are all profoundly Masonic, the cockerel represents the 'Cock of Resurrection' often placed with the 'Paschal Lamb' (as discussed earlier). While this was suggested to indicate French origin, I would note that in other cases the Paschal lamb was joined with French inspired regalia c.1797, on Scottish Rite aprons (op. cit. p112 , 4.22).

There were unbound connections between British, French and for that matter, American Masonic lodges in these times.

It is interesting to see the 'dirk' itself among the pastiche of symbols on the blade of this piece. It seems that symbol often occurs as well in certain degrees of the Scottish Rite. Other symbols such as skull and crossbones have more broad meaning in Masonic symbolism, as do the 'All Seeing Eye' which recalls the origins back to Solomon and Hiram Abiff etc.

In all, a most intriguing item of distinctively British Masonic regalia and as noted, Georgian period in early years of 19th c.

Cathey · 22nd July 2016, 05:35 AM

Hi Guys

As I mentioned previously the royal Naval lodge was founded in 1739. Having discussed this dirk at length with a Naval collector he reassured me that it is Naval but would have belonged to an officer who was also a member of the Naval lodge in the Georgian period.

The Guard has the typical English lion hilt common to many Naval dirks and an English rose on the cross guard.

Regards

Cathey and Rex

20th July 2016, 08:07 PM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,459	Guys, thank you for bringing this thread back! Actually the notion that this is a naval officers dirk was probably simply because of the well established use of them in that context. The animal head is indeed intended to be a lion head, in this configuration it corresponds to British infantry officers sabre hilts (M1803) and other military and naval hilts of the Georgian period. Looking further into this, it would seem that this is most likely a dirk made specifically for a Freemason, and probably of the Order of Knights Templar. While checking references on Freemasonry, in this case which are on the American aspects, in many if not most cases, the allegory and symbolism used in Freemasonry transcends nationality and other denominators. From "Material Culture of the American Freemasons" (John D. Hamilton, 1994, p159): 'Knights Templar Dirk" "...both real and false dirks were worn attached to a regalia baldric or sash as an insignia of the Templar Order. Real dirks were prescribed for regalia worn by Knights Templar only in certain commanderies". With the numerous symbols on this blade, it would seem perhaps that either it was intended for an individual with achievements in a number of degrees or associations in various rites or steps. In most cases, there is a wide spectrum of perceptions held toward these symbols. For non Freemasons such as myself, it is often dangerous to try to offer meanings and definitive assessments of these. The very secretive nature of Masonry has lead to prolific writings and material which can mostly be regarded as speculative. The grips on the hilt in ivory for example, have the familiar Palladian arch, which while an architectural feature of the Renaissance, and from a famed architect and Mason, also appeared in Georgian and Federal designs in other than Masonic cases. The rest of the symbols on the blade are all profoundly Masonic, the cockerel represents the 'Cock of Resurrection' often placed with the 'Paschal Lamb' (as discussed earlier). While this was suggested to indicate French origin, I would note that in other cases the Paschal lamb was joined with French inspired regalia c.1797, on Scottish Rite aprons (op. cit. p112 , 4.22). There were unbound connections between British, French and for that matter, American Masonic lodges in these times. It is interesting to see the 'dirk' itself among the pastiche of symbols on the blade of this piece. It seems that symbol often occurs as well in certain degrees of the Scottish Rite. Other symbols such as skull and crossbones have more broad meaning in Masonic symbolism, as do the 'All Seeing Eye' which recalls the origins back to Solomon and Hiram Abiff etc. In all, a most intriguing item of distinctively British Masonic regalia and as noted, Georgian period in early years of 19th c. Last edited by Jim McDougall; 20th July 2016 at 08:51 PM.

22nd July 2016, 05:35 AM	#7
Cathey Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: adelaide south australia Posts: 284	I believe the dirk is Naval Hi Guys As I mentioned previously the royal Naval lodge was founded in 1739. Having discussed this dirk at length with a Naval collector he reassured me that it is Naval but would have belonged to an officer who was also a member of the Naval lodge in the Georgian period. The Guard has the typical English lion hilt common to many Naval dirks and an English rose on the cross guard. Regards Cathey and Rex

18th June 2016, 05:50 PM	#1
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,459	As always, Cathey posts fascinating examples that promote great discussions, and this one has been outstanding, not just for the intriguing subject matter, but the teamwork in sharing and observing details. The Masonic theme in weaponry has been a constant fascination for many years, but often somewhat overlooked. In this case, the Masonic symbols placed in the motif of this dirk are not only obvious but compelling . It often amazes me at just how thoroughly Freemasonry has permeated historic figures and events as well as the cultures of their times. Presently we are travelling through the Southwest, and even in these 'Wild West' cow towns the Masonic mystique prevailed. Coincidentally I was just researching some Masonic swords in a small museum in one in Arizona, where the primary focus was of course gunfighters and such history related to the OK Corral. Here, along with the fabled six shooters, were a number of clearly Masonic swords, belonging to prominent figures in the town (not the gunfighters of course . Returning to Nelson and the Dirk in discussion. It is important to remember that Freemasonry was of course prevalent in military context as typically officers were of the gentry or varying levels of peerage. This being the case, naturally many, if not most, were highly involved in Masonic activity. I suspect that in many cases, Masonic allegiance was predominant as there were certainly indistinct ties between members of lodges in France, and Great Britain. Regarding Masonic related decoration and styling, it seems that in the neo classic styles in many edged weapons of the latter 18th century may have had even more subtle nuance, for example the 'five ball hilt' type of officers spadroon of 1780 +. These apparently evolved in England, but later, in a remarkable instance, were adopted in France as similar hilts termed as l'Anglaise. In research many years ago, I thought that perhaps the 'balls' or 'beads' incorporated in the hilt elements may have had numeric significance, particularly in a Masonic sense with the number 5 . In France others had sometimes 7, but again, symbolism? These ideas were inconclusive, and even Robson discounted the idea, thinking the decoration was simply aesthetic. Still, as more Masonic themes become apparent, I still wonder.

23rd June 2016, 04:38 PM	#2
Richard G Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 412	Probably need a Mason to answer this one, but bearing in mind their reputation for secrecy, would this be a Masonic dagger, possibly belonging to a Lodge, for use in Masonic rituals, or would it be the dagger of a Naval Officer who was a Mason, and didn't care who knew it? Regards Richard

18th July 2016, 06:32 PM	#3
Will M Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: In the wee woods north of Napanee Ontario Posts: 395	Richard I believe this dagger/dirk would have been used by a navy officer. The blade etching would not normally be seen except if drawn for use. Masons took pride in who they were and didn't hide the fact of who they were. Many politicians, lawyers, etc. were masons, even US presidents. I have many framed mason documents of my grandfathers including when he was Grand Superintendent of Toronto East Disttrict #8.

19th July 2016, 09:50 AM	#4
Helleri Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Chino, CA. Posts: 219	What animal is the metal part of the grip mean to resemble? Also the side ring of the guard (maybe both of them?) has some sort of animal or symbol as well but I can't figure on what it is.

20th July 2016, 01:14 PM	#5
Richard G Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 412	Will, looking at this again, I'm still not sure. I can't see any naval connection other than the style of the dirk itself. I wonder if it is a masonic dirk, plain and simple' Helleri, the pommel is supposed to be a lions head. This sort of 'upper half only head' is normal for this type of dirk. Regards Richard