Sawfish sword

ariel · 18th January 2016, 07:17 PM

Good examples, Vandoo.
Weapons outlive their purpose and with it their meaning.

Islanders used sawfish swords as true weapons, just like Native Americans used flint knives. They did it for as long as there were no replacements.
When (and if) iron became available, newly-made examples ceased to exist as historical weapons and became art objects, ceremonial/parade contraptions, tourist fodder etc.

I would find it impossible to believe that despite wide availability of iron implements, sawfish swords retained even a minimal role as weapons per se. The Chinese, German and Indian examples shown here are just arts and crafts. Nobody in his right mind would actually pit them against even the crudest steel sword.

As a matter of fact, even steel swords share the same fate: millions of them shed blood in the 17-18 centuries, but now, with tanks, missiles, planes and machine guns, swords are just parade toys.

And in another vein: would any of us collect modern China- or India-made swords made out of even the most beautiful damascus?

mahratt · 18th January 2016, 10:43 PM

Dear Ariel
Very soon all seriously interested in the matter will be able to draw conclusions on how to, when and who used rostrum sawfish in the Indo-Persia, as a weapon.
I will let you know in this topic name of the journal in which the English language will my article: Using the sawfish rostrums (Pristis pectinatus) as a weapon in the Indo-Iranian region inthe XVth – XIXth centuries.

Best Regards

VANDOO · 22nd January 2016, 10:22 PM

MAHRATT I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOUR ARTICLE KEEP US POSTED. HERE IS A PICTURE OF TWO VARIETIES OF SAWFISH FOR COMPARISON. THE SMALL TOOTHED MORE NARROW ONE BEING THE TYPE COMMON IN THE RED SEA AND INDIAN OCEAN. THE BROAD LARGE TOOTHED ONE IS WHAT IS FOUND IN THE GULF OF MEXICO AND LIKELY THRU-OUT THE CARIBBEAN. I DON'T KNOW THE FULL RANGE OF THESE SPECIES. I INCLUDE TWO PICTURES OF A FOSSIL SAWFISH ROSTRUM AND SOME TEETH. THE LARGE SECTION IS 10 INCHES LONG THEY ARE FROM MOROCCO, CRETACEOUS PERIOD. ONCOPRISTUS NUMIDUS SAWFISH.

mahratt · 22nd January 2016, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

MAHRATT I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOUR ARTICLE KEEP US POSTED.

Vandoo, I will inform you as soon as the magazine will appear in print.

mahratt · 22nd January 2016, 11:01 PM

Photos:

mahratt · 3rd August 2016, 10:35 AM

Dear participants of the Forum,
I represent to your attention the article:

VANDOO · 4th August 2016, 02:28 AM

IS THE ARTICLE IN ENGLISH ? I LOOKED UP HE SITE BUT DID NOT FIND THE RECENT PUBLICATION LISTED OR A WAY TO ORDER IT. THERE ONLY SEEMS TO BE THE ABSTRACT OF THE ARTICLE ON THE FORUM POST IS THERE A WAY TO LINK WITH IT AND READ IT ON THE POST. I LOOK FORWARD TO READING YOUR ARTICLE. THANKS

22nd January 2016, 10:22 PM	#3
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	MAHRATT I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOUR ARTICLE KEEP US POSTED. HERE IS A PICTURE OF TWO VARIETIES OF SAWFISH FOR COMPARISON. THE SMALL TOOTHED MORE NARROW ONE BEING THE TYPE COMMON IN THE RED SEA AND INDIAN OCEAN. THE BROAD LARGE TOOTHED ONE IS WHAT IS FOUND IN THE GULF OF MEXICO AND LIKELY THRU-OUT THE CARIBBEAN. I DON'T KNOW THE FULL RANGE OF THESE SPECIES. I INCLUDE TWO PICTURES OF A FOSSIL SAWFISH ROSTRUM AND SOME TEETH. THE LARGE SECTION IS 10 INCHES LONG THEY ARE FROM MOROCCO, CRETACEOUS PERIOD. ONCOPRISTUS NUMIDUS SAWFISH. Attached Images

22nd January 2016, 11:01 PM	#5
mahratt Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Russia Posts: 1,042	Photos: Attached Images

3rd August 2016, 10:35 AM	#6
mahratt Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Russia Posts: 1,042	Dear participants of the Forum, I represent to your attention the article: Attached Images

18th January 2016, 07:17 PM	#1
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Good examples, Vandoo. Weapons outlive their purpose and with it their meaning. Islanders used sawfish swords as true weapons, just like Native Americans used flint knives. They did it for as long as there were no replacements. When (and if) iron became available, newly-made examples ceased to exist as historical weapons and became art objects, ceremonial/parade contraptions, tourist fodder etc. I would find it impossible to believe that despite wide availability of iron implements, sawfish swords retained even a minimal role as weapons per se. The Chinese, German and Indian examples shown here are just arts and crafts. Nobody in his right mind would actually pit them against even the crudest steel sword. As a matter of fact, even steel swords share the same fate: millions of them shed blood in the 17-18 centuries, but now, with tanks, missiles, planes and machine guns, swords are just parade toys. And in another vein: would any of us collect modern China- or India-made swords made out of even the most beautiful damascus?

18th January 2016, 10:43 PM	#2
mahratt Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Russia Posts: 1,042	Dear Ariel Very soon all seriously interested in the matter will be able to draw conclusions on how to, when and who used rostrum sawfish in the Indo-Persia, as a weapon. I will let you know in this topic name of the journal in which the English language will my article: Using the sawfish rostrums (Pristis pectinatus) as a weapon in the Indo-Iranian region inthe XVth – XIXth centuries. Best Regards

4th August 2016, 02:28 AM	#7
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	IS THE ARTICLE IN ENGLISH ? I LOOKED UP HE SITE BUT DID NOT FIND THE RECENT PUBLICATION LISTED OR A WAY TO ORDER IT. THERE ONLY SEEMS TO BE THE ABSTRACT OF THE ARTICLE ON THE FORUM POST IS THERE A WAY TO LINK WITH IT AND READ IT ON THE POST. I LOOK FORWARD TO READING YOUR ARTICLE. THANKS