Ottoman Kard with Repurposed Yataghan Turkish Ribbon Blade

mahratt · 13th December 2015, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estcrh

With all of these examples it seems that type must have come from a particular region.

Turkmens live in northern Afghanistan. But in Afghanistan these knives are not found... I was told that they come from the border areas of Turkey and Syria. There, too, there are Turkmens.

estcrh · 13th December 2015, 08:47 PM

All of the blades look to be from different sources.

mahratt · 14th December 2015, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by estcrh

All of the blades look to be from different sources.

In my opinion this situation is indicative of the absence of developed forging Technology weapons. We can see something similar in Bukhara and Khiva Khanate of the 19th century, where most of the blades of shamshirs, daggers and knives were imported from Persia.

That is, in this case, in the absence of production of quality blades, for the manufacture of Turkmen kards, take any suitable blade, which fall into the hands of the master.

ALEX · 14th December 2015, 11:02 AM

Mahratt, I had similar thoughts (reply #11 above). You are right of course, there were 300,000 Turkmens living in Syria, most near Turkish border.
As we saw, these kards are often attributed to Persia, Turkmenistan or Afghanistan regions, with Turkmen tribal being closest fit. However, having no bolsters, the distinct blade mounting and Ottoman-like decorations, Syrian Turkmen origin is quite plausible. The metal rings and inlays on the handle are also reminiscent of another Syrian "Majdel Shams" hilts and shamshir hilts produced in Syria during Ottoman period.
Good discussion, thanks to all who responded!

Lee · 14th December 2015, 12:18 PM

Here is another example with the forte of a Persian shamshir being reformed into a kard blade.

ALEX · 14th December 2015, 12:49 PM

Lee, what an awesome kard!
Further shows the re-purposeful nature of this type, with many having blades from other weapons. What strikes me the most is similarity of handle/blade assembly. All have identical mounting technique with similar decoration elements. I am inclined to categorize it as Syrian-Turkmen Kard.
Once again, thanks to all for great contribution into what could be a fascinating discovery.

13th December 2015, 08:47 PM	#2
estcrh Member Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: USA Posts: 1,492	All of the blades look to be from different sources. Attached Images

14th December 2015, 12:18 PM	#5
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 932	Another Example Here is another example with the forte of a Persian shamshir being reformed into a kard blade. Attached Images

14th December 2015, 11:02 AM	#4
ALEX Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 936	Mahratt, I had similar thoughts (reply #11 above). You are right of course, there were 300,000 Turkmens living in Syria, most near Turkish border. As we saw, these kards are often attributed to Persia, Turkmenistan or Afghanistan regions, with Turkmen tribal being closest fit. However, having no bolsters, the distinct blade mounting and Ottoman-like decorations, Syrian Turkmen origin is quite plausible. The metal rings and inlays on the handle are also reminiscent of another Syrian "Majdel Shams" hilts and shamshir hilts produced in Syria during Ottoman period. Good discussion, thanks to all who responded!

14th December 2015, 12:49 PM	#6
ALEX Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 936	Lee, what an awesome kard! Further shows the re-purposeful nature of this type, with many having blades from other weapons. What strikes me the most is similarity of handle/blade assembly. All have identical mounting technique with similar decoration elements. I am inclined to categorize it as Syrian-Turkmen Kard. Once again, thanks to all for great contribution into what could be a fascinating discovery.