Odd Sword

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 8th August 2015, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

I think that the investigative analysis that has evolved involving the blade which initiated this thread is fascinating, and it is truly impressive to see looks into various alphabets and characters in these mysterious letters.

The outstanding approach toward this inscription (in #1) is very insightful and helps a lot in perspective on these on blades. Whether we can find anything conclusive or not, the content of the factors brought into the discussion is fascinating and great to learn more!

Salaams Jim and thank you for you well timed analysis so far on this important subject. I was looking through library and found a reference at http://siberiantimes.com/science/cas...-the-terrible/ which again examines the possible meaning on the blade.

I personally prefer the wider meaning/theory behind the writing rather than the absolute meaning not least because of the time it takes to even begin to unravel the basics... On another note I would rather see this thread over on the European as it rather belongs there.... which may sound a bit strange since the project at #1 was supposedly Omani or at least with an Omani Pommel and half a tang..

Thanks again for your important input.

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

fernando · 9th August 2015, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

... On another note I would rather see this thread over on the European as it rather belongs there.... which may sound a bit strange since the project at #1 was supposedly Omani or at least with an Omani Pommel and half a tang...

Let's then copy (better than move) this thread to the European section. Remember that future posts will not have a 'dual' effect, but will only fall into the forum they are directed to.

ariel · 21st October 2018, 03:42 AM

Only 3 years passed since the last post... In Darwinian term it is a millisecond:-)
Is the blade hexagonal? Or clearly lenticular ( i.e. biconvex)?

fernando · 21st October 2018, 04:38 PM

To my eyes and judging by its ricasso, it starts hexagonal, and would change to lenticular ... both on the thin side

.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 9th November 2018, 06:01 PM

Lech Marek places a fascinating piece of research on the detail around BENEDICTus style inscriptions on sword blades see http://www.academia.edu/13386318/THE...l._10_pp._9-20

This is hugely detailed but is also very informative describing the ritual of blessing swords etc...

ariel · 10th November 2018, 11:19 AM

To my eyes this hexagonal blade looks like a worn out and modified example of a Spanish cavalry blade 1728 pattern. They produced it in different sizes till the end of 18 century when they switched to the curved blade.

http://perso.wanadoo.es/jjperez222/tropacab_e.htm

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 10th November 2018, 01:51 PM

In looking at my reference thus staying on Benidictus style script I see the letters again could be interesting ..

M 51 DD M

The Book of Revelation is often referred to as 51... So are we off to a reasonable set of meaningful code?

In suggesting Portuguese origin of blade form at http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...rtuguese+swords it could of course point to another source as actual blade manufacture; Solingen. This would suggest the religious nature of the blade marks as being in line with the reference above at http://www.academia.edu/13386318/TH...ol._10_pp._9-20

Could the DD indicate In Nomini Domini or perhaps Dominus Deus? http://www.academia.edu/13386318/TH....10_pp._9-20and the two outer M shapes be some sort of decorative introduction or brackets?

This weapon is indeed interesting as an Ethnographic example whereby an old blade has been given a mixed cloak namely the Solomon star decoration and the added extension of extra tang and Pommel of an Omani Dancing Sword. The blade appears much older than the Pommel which is from a distinctive 19thC Dancing Sword style. I have shown in a previous post how this is achieved and particularly in the souk workshops of Muttrah where it is common practice. It should be noted that in the case of Omani Dancing Swords a weak point caused by vibration is about half way up the tang...Omani Dancers are made with tang and pommel and blade in one piece and it may be observed that the curved Omani Kattara is not so it has to have a tang extension and pommel added to every weapon...

I digress... however, it is the tang and Pommel which brings the entire weapon to the table from the Ethnographic viewpoint. Decoration to the Pommel is superb following the Solomon style star but I have never seen it before on a Pommel.

By way of a correction it may be seen that the initial and final letters are not the M letter but the old fashioned way of presenting the letter A

10th November 2018, 11:19 AM	#6
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	To my eyes this hexagonal blade looks like a worn out and modified example of a Spanish cavalry blade 1728 pattern. They produced it in different sizes till the end of 18 century when they switched to the curved blade. http://perso.wanadoo.es/jjperez222/tropacab_e.htm Last edited by ariel; 10th November 2018 at 03:28 PM. Reason: addt. info

10th November 2018, 01:51 PM	#7
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	In looking at my reference thus staying on Benidictus style script I see the letters again could be interesting .. M 51 DD M The Book of Revelation is often referred to as 51... So are we off to a reasonable set of meaningful code? In suggesting Portuguese origin of blade form at http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...rtuguese+swords it could of course point to another source as actual blade manufacture; Solingen. This would suggest the religious nature of the blade marks as being in line with the reference above at http://www.academia.edu/13386318/TH...ol._10_pp._9-20 Could the DD indicate In Nomini Domini or perhaps Dominus Deus? http://www.academia.edu/13386318/TH....10_pp._9-20and the two outer M shapes be some sort of decorative introduction or brackets? This weapon is indeed interesting as an Ethnographic example whereby an old blade has been given a mixed cloak namely the Solomon star decoration and the added extension of extra tang and Pommel of an Omani Dancing Sword. The blade appears much older than the Pommel which is from a distinctive 19thC Dancing Sword style. I have shown in a previous post how this is achieved and particularly in the souk workshops of Muttrah where it is common practice. It should be noted that in the case of Omani Dancing Swords a weak point caused by vibration is about half way up the tang...Omani Dancers are made with tang and pommel and blade in one piece and it may be observed that the curved Omani Kattara is not so it has to have a tang extension and pommel added to every weapon... I digress... however, it is the tang and Pommel which brings the entire weapon to the table from the Ethnographic viewpoint. Decoration to the Pommel is superb following the Solomon style star but I have never seen it before on a Pommel. By way of a correction it may be seen that the initial and final letters are not the M letter but the old fashioned way of presenting the letter A Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 10th November 2018 at 03:45 PM.

21st October 2018, 03:42 AM	#3
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Only 3 years passed since the last post... In Darwinian term it is a millisecond:-) Is the blade hexagonal? Or clearly lenticular ( i.e. biconvex)?

21st October 2018, 04:38 PM	#4
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	To my eyes and judging by its ricasso, it starts hexagonal, and would change to lenticular ... both on the thin side .

9th November 2018, 06:01 PM	#5
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Lech Marek places a fascinating piece of research on the detail around BENEDICTus style inscriptions on sword blades see http://www.academia.edu/13386318/THE...l._10_pp._9-20 This is hugely detailed but is also very informative describing the ritual of blessing swords etc...