Tomas Aiala Cup hilt rapier.

[fernando]

Could that be a mark inh the ricasso, Jean-Luc ?


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[M ELEY]

Spanish colonial? The bars of the hilt brazed directly to the cup, the plainness of the piece and grooved horn grip, the simple, undecorated pommel and quillon ends and lack of a ridge along the cup guard all seem to point to a so-called 'Caribbean cuphilt type'. Just a guess, though and I'll let Fernando or others shine light on this one! In any case, a great dueling rapier!

[fernando]

Looks Iberian to me but ... what do i know ?
The brazed bars could only mean this is a Portuguese sword, according to the basics.
My doubt to define whether this is a civilian or a military sword goes for the knuckle guard being fixed by a screw, a military detail, and the fine long rapier blade, more a fencing weapon for a civilian.
But then, i may tend to the civilian version, as the screw fixation may also represent a late age for tyhe sword ... like beg. XVIII century.
But these are all conjectures; no authority here

[Cerjak]

Originally Posted by fernando

Could that be a mark inh the ricasso, Jean-Luc ?


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Fernando

Here a close picture from the ricasso I don't think that it is a mark.

Best
CERJAK

[Jim McDougall]

I think Mark has good points on the character of the hilt with the manner of quillons attached to cup, and simplicity of the cup with raised ridge but no rompepuntas.
While this hilt has those characteristics suggesting colonial origin, the pommel seems of third quarter + classical 'urn' style. The knuckleguard screw into the pommel recalls English dragoon hilts of this period and earlier.

The blade seems to be of Solingen character of early 18th century versions of Aiala blades, and the 'anchor' seems to correspond somewhat to various examples on blades of these times. I believe that Germany began producing these rapier blades for Spanish colonial use in the 17th well into the 18th if I understand correctly.

With the combination of these, the more refined look of the grip, I would suggest this might be a Portuguese version of cuphilt for officers dress and of latter 18th.in present mounts using earlier Solingen Aiala blade. It seems that Portuguese cuphilts were with an almost colonial look were known if I recall earlier discussions correctly. The English associated elements bring to mind the various connections between Portugal and England in these times.

[ulfberth]

Well Cerjak,

It seems you got most of your answers, looking at the way the cup and the hilt is made, its form and symmetry I'm leaning towards 18th century....
Congratulations with this pure and original cup hilt rapier !

Kind regards

Ulfberth

[Cerjak]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

I think Mark has good points on the character of the hilt with the manner of quillons attached to cup, and simplicity of the cup with raised ridge but no rompepuntas.
While this hilt has those characteristics suggesting colonial origin, the pommel seems of third quarter + classical 'urn' style. The knuckleguard screw into the pommel recalls English dragoon hilts of this period and earlier.

The blade seems to be of Solingen character of early 18th century versions of Aiala blades, and the 'anchor' seems to correspond somewhat to various examples on blades of these times. I believe that Germany began producing these rapier blades for Spanish colonial use in the 17th well into the 18th if I understand correctly.

With the combination of these, the more refined look of the grip, I would suggest this might be a Portuguese version of cuphilt for officers dress and of latter 18th.in present mounts using earlier Solingen Aiala blade. It seems that Portuguese cuphilts were with an almost colonial look were known if I recall earlier discussions correctly. The English associated elements bring to mind the various connections between Portugal and England in these times.

Hello Jim

I was expected your opinion and I would like to thank you for your so well constructed analyse there is a last detail I would like to understand about the size who is about 120 cm in my eyes it is a lot for a dress sword it is difficult to wear it, may be you could explain me.
Best

Jean-Luc

[fernando]

You don't let this type of sword pend to the ground; its typical mode of scabbard holder together with your hand holding down the grip makes them go almost horizontal.
In any case, a sword with this length is not practical bor (military) battle but makes it good for (civilian/school) fencing; you intend to reach your adversary's body before he reaches yours.

[fernando]

Concerning this type of brazed quillons, pommel an cup looking Colonial, as i admited, i don't know. But that they make the Portuguese style, i make it certain.
Attached are two examples of such hilts, with and without knuckle guard screw, both with alegories to Portuguese Kings in their blades.


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[Cerjak]

Dear Fernando
Thank you for the pictures the first one is for me very similar from mine ( wooden handle and simple cup and quillons and same type of urn' style pommel only the knuckle guard screw .
Do you know from which period is the first hilt ?

Best

Jean-Luc