Interesting odd klewang at eBay

Ian · 15th December 2005, 12:28 PM

Michael:

I was following that one too and don't recognize it as an established sword style. Even managed to get in a bid that fell way short. I don't know where it's from but the blade struck me as a modified European saber. The hilt seems to show some Sumatran/Aceh influence, while the terminal "bud" does look a little Visayan.

Maybe a custom assembly for a European living in Sumatra.

Ian.

kai · 15th December 2005, 01:25 PM

My condolences to all fellow bidders...

I'm stumped, too. Some Parang Nabur blades are similar but I can't recall a similarly extensive fuller. I was thinking more of a Ladieng without the usual broadened tip. The light construction seems to suggest a fighting piece rather than a tool and I hoped the obscure hilt would help to pin down the origin of this beast eventually.

I'm not sure about the blade - a decent etching might reveal more about the forging process. However, is it possible to grind this tip shape out of an European blade without getting a very thin tip where the fuller would pass, Ian?

Regards,
Kai

VVV · 15th December 2005, 01:55 PM

Ian and Kai,

Thanks for your interesting comments.
Ian, the idea of a rehilted European saber is interesting. Either made for a European or captured/traded by f.i. a Batak who made some personal modifications regarding the hilt.
The hilt is confusing. Very much like a Rudus hilt on the grip but the top part doesn't fit in.
Kai, I also first thought of a Ladieng until I looked closer to the Seller's pictures. On the Nabur I agree on the fuller as well as they are not as slender as this blade.

Michael

kai · 15th December 2005, 02:17 PM

Hi Michael,

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVV

On the Nabur I agree on the fuller as well as they are not as slender as this blade.

Well, Fig. 388 in Zonneveld shows a Nabur with also very slender blade. Incidentally, 389 & 390 show a shallow fuller (still quite different from the discussed example) and the latter pic also has a very vaguely bud-like pommel piece. Borneo is a vast area, so poorly known hilt types may be a possibility.

Regards,
Kai

Bill · 15th December 2005, 03:04 PM

Agree with Kai and the examples cited. May have been originally doubled edged towards the blade tip or modified for definitive warfare; used like the panabas as a clean-up.

VVV · 15th December 2005, 03:34 PM

Kai,

I retract my earlier comment on the slender blade.
I have one resembling pict 388 - that's even a bit longer - and of course the XXL ones have a more slender blade than the "regular" or very short Naburs.
Thanks also for commenting on the bud. I don't have any of this variation but have handled 390 IRL and "almost" got one at Herman Historica last Spring (Auction 48 - lot 2813 if you want an additional reference picture than the one in van Z). I forgot about it because it's quite rare.
On pict 389 I am a bit sceptical to if it should be called a Parang Nabur if it doesn't have the D-guard, but that's another discussion...

Thanks for all input!

Michael

RhysMichael · 15th December 2005, 04:45 PM

Just my thoughts. The blade on here strongly reminds me of the blades on Aceh peudeueng peusangan( aka sikin peusangan, sikin pasagan ). Compare these two

Of course the handle is very different. I would like to hear if others see the resemblance in the blade or not

The hilt does have some resemblance to a hulu tapa guda. You can see on on D. Buttins site here : http://old.blades.free.fr/pics/picsw...ang/kle03p.jpg
And the tulip bud is a common motif in Aceh art, many of the other carvings shown also resemble motifs and designs seen in "Hands of Time - Crafts of Aceh" by Barbara Leigh. Of course there are many other places in the region that use similar designs. That being said I think there is a strong case to be made for it being an Aceh sword

Ian · 15th December 2005, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

I'm not sure about the blade - a decent etching might reveal more about the forging process. However, is it possible to grind this tip shape out of an European blade without getting a very thin tip where the fuller would pass, Ian?

Regards,
Kai

Kai:

I don't know, Kai, but that whole tip area looks heavily pitted which suggested to me that it may have been "reworked." The amount of wear there is disproportionate to the rest of the blade. Perhaps others might be able to answer that question. I suppose it would depend how long the original saber was, and how much it may have been shortened, as to how thin the fuller may have been.

Interesting sword.

Ian.

15th December 2005, 04:45 PM	#7
RhysMichael Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Virginia Posts: 520	Just my thoughts. The blade on here strongly reminds me of the blades on Aceh peudeueng peusangan( aka sikin peusangan, sikin pasagan ). Compare these two Of course the handle is very different. I would like to hear if others see the resemblance in the blade or not The hilt does have some resemblance to a hulu tapa guda. You can see on on D. Buttins site here : http://old.blades.free.fr/pics/picsw...ang/kle03p.jpg And the tulip bud is a common motif in Aceh art, many of the other carvings shown also resemble motifs and designs seen in "Hands of Time - Crafts of Aceh" by Barbara Leigh. Of course there are many other places in the region that use similar designs. That being said I think there is a strong case to be made for it being an Aceh sword Last edited by RhysMichael; 15th December 2005 at 05:56 PM.

15th December 2005, 12:28 PM	#1
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,399	Michael: I was following that one too and don't recognize it as an established sword style. Even managed to get in a bid that fell way short. I don't know where it's from but the blade struck me as a modified European saber. The hilt seems to show some Sumatran/Aceh influence, while the terminal "bud" does look a little Visayan. Maybe a custom assembly for a European living in Sumatra. Ian.

15th December 2005, 01:25 PM	#2
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	My condolences to all fellow bidders... I'm stumped, too. Some Parang Nabur blades are similar but I can't recall a similarly extensive fuller. I was thinking more of a Ladieng without the usual broadened tip. The light construction seems to suggest a fighting piece rather than a tool and I hoped the obscure hilt would help to pin down the origin of this beast eventually. I'm not sure about the blade - a decent etching might reveal more about the forging process. However, is it possible to grind this tip shape out of an European blade without getting a very thin tip where the fuller would pass, Ian? Regards, Kai

15th December 2005, 01:55 PM	#3
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Ian and Kai, Thanks for your interesting comments. Ian, the idea of a rehilted European saber is interesting. Either made for a European or captured/traded by f.i. a Batak who made some personal modifications regarding the hilt. The hilt is confusing. Very much like a Rudus hilt on the grip but the top part doesn't fit in. Kai, I also first thought of a Ladieng until I looked closer to the Seller's pictures. On the Nabur I agree on the fuller as well as they are not as slender as this blade. Michael

15th December 2005, 03:04 PM	#5
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	Agree with Kai and the examples cited. May have been originally doubled edged towards the blade tip or modified for definitive warfare; used like the panabas as a clean-up.

15th December 2005, 03:34 PM	#6
VVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sweden Posts: 1,637	Kai, I retract my earlier comment on the slender blade. I have one resembling pict 388 - that's even a bit longer - and of course the XXL ones have a more slender blade than the "regular" or very short Naburs. Thanks also for commenting on the bud. I don't have any of this variation but have handled 390 IRL and "almost" got one at Herman Historica last Spring (Auction 48 - lot 2813 if you want an additional reference picture than the one in van Z). I forgot about it because it's quite rare. On pict 389 I am a bit sceptical to if it should be called a Parang Nabur if it doesn't have the D-guard, but that's another discussion... Thanks for all input! Michael