Catalogue of my collection

simatua · 13th December 2005, 06:48 PM

Thanks for the invitation BlueErf ! (to join the kampungnet and place photo's from my collection.)
I managed myself into the site from kampungnet.
Got last weeknd a digital camara from my wife. I started already a try out of my collection on kampungnet.

Someone ??? Did a great job for me on the outside of the album !!!
I dont know who did it.? thanks a very very ....very lot !!!

This coming weekend i will take good pictures and place a lot more it on the site.
hoping everyone can enjoy and learning from eachother.

greets

Alam Shah · 14th December 2005, 01:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simatua

Thanks for the invitation BlueErf ! (to join the kampungnet and place photo's from my collection.)
I managed myself into the site from kampungnet.
Got last weeknd a digital camara from my wife. I started already a try out of my collection on kampungnet.

Someone ??? Did a great job for me on the outside of the album !!!
I dont know who did it.? thanks a very very ....very lot !!!

This coming weekend i will take good pictures and place a lot more it on the site.
hoping everyone can enjoy and learning from each other.

greets

That's the spirit.

Welcome aboard. Lovely Karno Tinanding keris...
At this point, I would like to invite everyone to create a personal keris gallery at kampungnet. May we learn and enjoy each other's pieces.

John · 14th December 2005, 02:23 AM

Simatua, I believe it was Alam Shah who did your cover at the KN gallery. He also did it for me when I started as well as assisted in arranging and captioning the initial pictures prior to me getting the hang of it. Good to see you breaking boundary of being the first Western collector there.

Would certainly like to see the pool expanding with more collector sharing even if you have one or two pieces...

BluErf · 14th December 2005, 01:26 PM

More pics pls!!!

simatua · 14th December 2005, 06:56 PM

pics are coming up this weekend.
I need good daylight for the photo's, artificial light does not show the blade very good, and a flash reflects 2much.

BluErf · 17th December 2005, 02:26 AM

As promised, pictures from K. Jensen's book Den Indonesiske kris.

1st 2 are hilts referred to in the book as 'Siva Bhairava'. The next 3 are referred to as 'stylized rakassas'

The Shiva hilt's posture (rajalila, I believe) is quite different from the realistic Rashaksa hilt's.

The stylized rashaksa hilts have a slightly more angular form compared to my example, but it supports the theory that my hilt could really be an abstract form of rashaksas.

The interesting thing however, is that the Shiva hilts were collected in the early 1600s while the stylized ones in 1690 (except the 3rd one, which was 1700s). In the book, there were many realistic rashaksa forms collected from the early 1600s (and dated to earlier periods because they were already old and worn when collected then) right up to the 1800s. This could mean that there was/and still is a period of co-existence between the realistic forms and the stylized forms.

Of course I would admit that I am relying on Mr K. Jensen's books and his pictures in postulating that my example is an abstract rashaksa.

Hidayat, a fellow member at Kampung net, shares that the realistic form is called 'Putro Satu' while the abstract form is called 'Putri Satu'. Putro means son while Putri means daughter. This could be a recent terminology like the 'wadon' term that has been given to the famous hilt that was commonly referred to as a form of Durga in another earlier (and very heatedly debated) thread. The thing is, the original terms for these hilts could have been 'lost'.

nechesh · 17th December 2005, 03:17 PM

Well, the repro is a little rough on some of these images, but they all appear to be beautiful hilts. I might have to get the Jensen book and brush up on my Dutch.

It looks fairly obvious that that lovely Shiva hilt doesn't belong on that first keris, doesn't it?

Anyway, i think you might be right, that the original terminology for these hilts may well have been lost. To me the last of them looks like it could be a stylized raksasa, but i wouldn't bet the farm on the other two. The first of them (the abstract hilts) almost looks more like a hanuman to me. I would not be at all surprised if more than one type of figurative form was cloaked in this type of vegetal abstraction. Wish we had better images.

Mans · 18th December 2005, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BluErf

..... that the realistic form is called 'Putro Satu' while the abstract form is called 'Putri Satu'. Putro means son while Putri means daughter. This could be a recent terminology like the 'wadon' term that has been given to the famous hilt that was commonly referred to as a form of Durga in another earlier (and very heatedly debated) thread.....

-------------------------
Putro Satu and Putri Satu;
'Putro' mean Son or guy.
'Putri' mean Lady, Girl or Daughter.
'Satu' mean One or First.
So, in Javanese and Maduranese term, Putro Satu mean Prince and Putri Satu mean Princess.

Oh ya, the 1st keris in my opinion nearer as an Old Balinese keris than Javanese. Its because bent of the Greneng and Ron Dho Nunut are dirrected to up.
The Old Balinese keris before Mataram Period resemble with Javanese (Pajajaran-Kediri-Singosari-Blambangan) keris although some ricikans still shown as the Balinese keris, specificaly on the form of Kembang Kacang, Lambe Gajah, Greneng, Ron Dho Nunut and Gonjo.

13th December 2005, 06:48 PM	#1
simatua Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 69	website cataloque on kampungnet Thanks for the invitation BlueErf ! (to join the kampungnet and place photo's from my collection.) I managed myself into the site from kampungnet. Got last weeknd a digital camara from my wife. I started already a try out of my collection on kampungnet. Someone ??? Did a great job for me on the outside of the album !!! I dont know who did it.? thanks a very very ....very lot !!! This coming weekend i will take good pictures and place a lot more it on the site. hoping everyone can enjoy and learning from eachother. greets

14th December 2005, 06:56 PM	#5
simatua Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 69	..coming up pics are coming up this weekend. I need good daylight for the photo's, artificial light does not show the blade very good, and a flash reflects 2much.

17th December 2005, 02:26 AM	#6
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	As promised, pictures from K. Jensen's book Den Indonesiske kris. 1st 2 are hilts referred to in the book as 'Siva Bhairava'. The next 3 are referred to as 'stylized rakassas' The Shiva hilt's posture (rajalila, I believe) is quite different from the realistic Rashaksa hilt's. The stylized rashaksa hilts have a slightly more angular form compared to my example, but it supports the theory that my hilt could really be an abstract form of rashaksas. The interesting thing however, is that the Shiva hilts were collected in the early 1600s while the stylized ones in 1690 (except the 3rd one, which was 1700s). In the book, there were many realistic rashaksa forms collected from the early 1600s (and dated to earlier periods because they were already old and worn when collected then) right up to the 1800s. This could mean that there was/and still is a period of co-existence between the realistic forms and the stylized forms. Of course I would admit that I am relying on Mr K. Jensen's books and his pictures in postulating that my example is an abstract rashaksa. Hidayat, a fellow member at Kampung net, shares that the realistic form is called 'Putro Satu' while the abstract form is called 'Putri Satu'. Putro means son while Putri means daughter. This could be a recent terminology like the 'wadon' term that has been given to the famous hilt that was commonly referred to as a form of Durga in another earlier (and very heatedly debated) thread. The thing is, the original terms for these hilts could have been 'lost'. Attached Images

14th December 2005, 02:23 AM	#3
John Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Land below the wind Posts: 135	Simatua, I believe it was Alam Shah who did your cover at the KN gallery. He also did it for me when I started as well as assisted in arranging and captioning the initial pictures prior to me getting the hang of it. Good to see you breaking boundary of being the first Western collector there. Would certainly like to see the pool expanding with more collector sharing even if you have one or two pieces...

14th December 2005, 01:26 PM	#4
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	More pics pls!!!

17th December 2005, 03:17 PM	#7
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Well, the repro is a little rough on some of these images, but they all appear to be beautiful hilts. I might have to get the Jensen book and brush up on my Dutch. It looks fairly obvious that that lovely Shiva hilt doesn't belong on that first keris, doesn't it? Anyway, i think you might be right, that the original terminology for these hilts may well have been lost. To me the last of them looks like it could be a stylized raksasa, but i wouldn't bet the farm on the other two. The first of them (the abstract hilts) almost looks more like a hanuman to me. I would not be at all surprised if more than one type of figurative form was cloaked in this type of vegetal abstraction. Wish we had better images.