Reproduction hooded katars?

estcrh · 13th April 2015, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashoka

At the risk of appearing totally clueless... I see nothing in these katars that suggests they are new fakes to me. They look totally typical South Indian Katars of this species 17th-18th c. Original condition 'lump of rust' and then polished rajasthan style with an angle grinder/and buffing wheel. In my opinion they are genuine - there are many around. nothing suggests otherwise to me. The quality of this type varies a lot from magnificent to very poor quality.

Its good to hear some different opinions, how about the two pata?

ashoka · 13th April 2015, 09:31 AM

These are not fakes either in my opinion, I haven't exactly seen that configuration before with the makarra heads holding the blade, but there are many lightweight brass patahs and other weapons from South India in this general style. Usually weakly constructed and presumably for temple and dance use. They are old, I hope the seller does not take issue with his name being posted on here next to words such as honesty and fake, as that seems a little harsh. Whether you like these pieces or not is another matter.

ariel · 13th April 2015, 12:39 PM

That was exactly the reason why I asked the question about rust/ patina.
Having seen quite few of such katars, I would not be so categorical about calling them fake. Just low-level, worn-out , but genuinely old junky katars.

As to the patas.... When did they start using screws from Home Depot in India?:-)

trenchwarfare · 13th April 2015, 02:09 PM

Urine is an excellent "patinating" agent. An item buried in the ground after being tinkled on, will look 80 years old in two days. I understand the Chinese use chicken poop, neutralized with diesel fuel.

ashoka · 13th April 2015, 03:46 PM

They aren't even particularly low level ones in my humble opinion, pretty reasonable quality. Years of use being polished with sand and abrasives, rusted totally then repolished badly with a buffing wheel makes them look worse than they are., with deep black pitting and the black buffing wax allover them. The decoration is pretty good, one has the two parrots found on Tanjore weapons. Better ones of these have the forte reinforced with an extra plate, these ones have it chiselled instead. re.Patahs - Screws do turn up in these decorative/ceremonial pieces, it doesn't discount them as being 19th century I think, it also does not indicate they are fakes either. In my opinion... I don't agree they have been artificially patinated in any way, the patina of both is typical.

13th April 2015, 09:31 AM	#2
ashoka Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 61	These are not fakes either in my opinion, I haven't exactly seen that configuration before with the makarra heads holding the blade, but there are many lightweight brass patahs and other weapons from South India in this general style. Usually weakly constructed and presumably for temple and dance use. They are old, I hope the seller does not take issue with his name being posted on here next to words such as honesty and fake, as that seems a little harsh. Whether you like these pieces or not is another matter. Last edited by ashoka; 13th April 2015 at 10:27 AM.

13th April 2015, 03:46 PM	#5
ashoka Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 61	They aren't even particularly low level ones in my humble opinion, pretty reasonable quality. Years of use being polished with sand and abrasives, rusted totally then repolished badly with a buffing wheel makes them look worse than they are., with deep black pitting and the black buffing wax allover them. The decoration is pretty good, one has the two parrots found on Tanjore weapons. Better ones of these have the forte reinforced with an extra plate, these ones have it chiselled instead. re.Patahs - Screws do turn up in these decorative/ceremonial pieces, it doesn't discount them as being 19th century I think, it also does not indicate they are fakes either. In my opinion... I don't agree they have been artificially patinated in any way, the patina of both is typical. Last edited by ashoka; 13th April 2015 at 07:36 PM.

13th April 2015, 12:39 PM	#3
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	That was exactly the reason why I asked the question about rust/ patina. Having seen quite few of such katars, I would not be so categorical about calling them fake. Just low-level, worn-out , but genuinely old junky katars. As to the patas.... When did they start using screws from Home Depot in India?:-)

13th April 2015, 02:09 PM	#4
trenchwarfare Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 385	Urine is an excellent "patinating" agent. An item buried in the ground after being tinkled on, will look 80 years old in two days. I understand the Chinese use chicken poop, neutralized with diesel fuel.