Cannon 1345 Besançon Bibliothèque municipale ms. 864

Andi · 18th March 2015, 10:22 PM

Sorry Marcus - I totally forgot to thank you for discovering this beautyful illustration which was unknown to me so far ..

Marcus den toom · 18th March 2015, 10:37 PM

No problem, it is my pleasure realy

I found lots of other pictures today as well.
I was trown by the simplicity of the mortars.. the Bellefortis is more complex than this picture. It is a miniature though so taking that in mind this is a most appt depiction of a early 15th century mortar.

I am putting them up on Pinterest, but here are the links for your enjoyment

Best,
Marcus

http://gallicalabs.bnf.fr/ark:/12148...90370/f99.zoom
http://gallicalabs.bnf.fr/ark:/12148...0370/f113.zoom
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/551339179357923616/
http://manuscriptminiatures.com/3932/10782/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ba..._Istanbul-.jpg

Andi · 19th March 2015, 10:00 PM

Thank you soo much

Battle of Nicopolis, 1396, Facsimile of a Miniature Conserved in the Topkapi Museum in Istanbul

I am not really familiar with islamic / otoman art but due to the clothing details of the red coated European looking man in the lower center of the image I would date it into the mid/late 17th century. What do you think?

Marcus den toom · 19th March 2015, 10:18 PM

Almost correct Andi

But no worries, seeing as that battle was fought with so many ethnically and stylisticly different people there was almost no way of knowing this.
It was made in 1523 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Empire (large scale: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._Nicopolis.jpg)
Edit: Am i mistaken when i see that the chap next to the one in the red coat (bottom left) is setting him on fire

Also these middle eastern weapons (just scroll down from the first picture and you will find more).
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/541557923915486756/

And:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_...%A1cs_1526.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_...leymanname.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janissaries

Andi · 20th March 2015, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus den toom

... Am i mistaken when i see that the chap next to the one in the red coat (bottom left) is setting him on fire

...

You are right. Great, this detail wasn't visible on the small image.

It looks like a classical case of "firendly fire"

19th March 2015, 10:18 PM	#4
Marcus den toom Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 543	Almost correct Andi But no worries, seeing as that battle was fought with so many ethnically and stylisticly different people there was almost no way of knowing this. It was made in 1523 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_Empire (large scale: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi..._Nicopolis.jpg) Edit: Am i mistaken when i see that the chap next to the one in the red coat (bottom left) is setting him on fire Also these middle eastern weapons (just scroll down from the first picture and you will find more). https://www.pinterest.com/pin/541557923915486756/ And: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_...%A1cs_1526.jpg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_...leymanname.jpg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janissaries Last edited by Marcus den toom; 19th March 2015 at 10:36 PM.

18th March 2015, 10:22 PM	#1
Andi Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Halstenbek, Germany Posts: 203	Sorry Marcus - I totally forgot to thank you for discovering this beautyful illustration which was unknown to me so far ..

18th March 2015, 10:37 PM	#2
Marcus den toom Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 543	No problem, it is my pleasure realy I found lots of other pictures today as well. I was trown by the simplicity of the mortars.. the Bellefortis is more complex than this picture. It is a miniature though so taking that in mind this is a most appt depiction of a early 15th century mortar. I am putting them up on Pinterest, but here are the links for your enjoyment Best, Marcus http://gallicalabs.bnf.fr/ark:/12148...90370/f99.zoom http://gallicalabs.bnf.fr/ark:/12148...0370/f113.zoom https://www.pinterest.com/pin/551339179357923616/ http://manuscriptminiatures.com/3932/10782/ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ba..._Istanbul-.jpg

19th March 2015, 10:00 PM	#3
Andi Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Halstenbek, Germany Posts: 203	Thank you soo much Battle of Nicopolis, 1396, Facsimile of a Miniature Conserved in the Topkapi Museum in Istanbul I am not really familiar with islamic / otoman art but due to the clothing details of the red coated European looking man in the lower center of the image I would date it into the mid/late 17th century. What do you think?