Sword from the lesser Sunda islands (Timor?)

kai · 2nd October 2014, 11:18 PM

<quote>
On item #2, posted by Udo (aka Sentrad) on Sept. 11th, 2014:

I am glad with the detailed photographs. Many, many details, I love it. As far I can see from these photographs (preferable one should feel it in the hand and even smell the natural origin of the materials!) it looks as it is genuine and a weapon with some age. But there are a few differences with what may be called 'the normal Har from Alor island'.

Hilt: as far I can see, this is made of wood. Which is strange. I know only two other made of wood. The decoration running along the 'forehead' differs slightly and is a bit more crudely made than what you would expect from a professional carver. Also the 'eye' is different: the usual form is a circle with a slightly bulbous centre (often covered with a disc made from tin or lead) and not a flat disc. Concerning the metal ferrule at the base of the hilt: normally it is a ring of horn around the base to prevent cracking. Aside from these two examples, I have not seen any metal ferrule on typical Alor sword hilts. This is sometimes seen in Wetar swords, not common though.

Blade: Mostly this is a straight one and more slender, a 'standard' import from Solor. Or, more rare, import from Southern Sulawesi (Rumbiah) with its typical rows of twistcore 'pamor'. These imported blades are often 'reshaped' by filing until obtaining the shape that the Alor people thought was their own tradition (passed on by their ancestors). I cannot see wether there is a brass peg inlaid along the back of the blade where it slopes down towards the tip. Most of the time (nine out of ten) it is present.

Sheath: The wood used here I recognize the same as on one of my swords from Wetar (Opi), also the way of patination on the rattan, now flaked, I found on sheaths of Wetar swords. As already said in my notes before on April 1st, 2010, the disc shaped finial or 'foot' of the sheath of item #1 (and of #2, too!) is weird and unique. It is even more curious to see TWO of these popping up in the same collection!

Provisional conservative conclusion: Because of the fact there are two pieces which have same features (wooden hilt with metal base, just a flat circle as 'eye', not 'standard' blades and rounded foot) and who differ from the 'normal' known swords from Alor, but who have, as far as can be seen from photographs, certain age and show use, it is possible this is a rather rare subspecies of the commonly known Har. That this is originating from Alor rather than from Wetar can be inferred from the carvings on both hilts as well as the sheath of item #1. As far as I know, Wetar Opi have plain hilts with no decoration nor eye, and have undecorated, somewhat wider scabbards.

As explained in my former notes the decoration of the 'wrongka' of item #1 should be from the centre of the island. It is a riddle which I do not have any solution for yet.

I may conclude this is an Alor sword which shows some Wetar influences. Import, immigration, marriage, trade, who knows?

Having said this: This makes collecting Indonesian weaponry so interesting. If you, as a collector, want to find everything easily in a book, you better collect stamps.

Karel Sirag
<unquote>

Sajen · 3rd October 2014, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

<quote>
Having said this: This makes collecting Indonesian weaponry so interesting. If you, as a collector, want to find everything easily in a book, you better collect stamps.

Karel Sirag
<unquote>

Very true!

Sajen · 3rd October 2014, 01:49 PM

I still have a Rugi/Har which I get once from my friend who is a "orang" Alor. He told me that this sword is from his father. This sword has a wooden hilt with iron ferrule (hidden by the red cloth), the carving is also a little bit crude, blade isn't laminated and the goats hair was replaced some years ago by the owner. He coming from the South of Alor, village Musape. The sword is 63,5 cm long, no scabbard. Blade is 4,4 mm thick at the base.

Sajen · 3rd October 2014, 01:57 PM

Maybe Udo can show some pictures from the smaller sword shown in post #8, this sword I've sold him years ago and coming from the same source.

Sajen · 3rd October 2014, 04:07 PM

Here two pictures from Alor warriors I just found by google.

3rd October 2014, 01:49 PM	#3
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,212	I still have a Rugi/Har which I get once from my friend who is a "orang" Alor. He told me that this sword is from his father. This sword has a wooden hilt with iron ferrule (hidden by the red cloth), the carving is also a little bit crude, blade isn't laminated and the goats hair was replaced some years ago by the owner. He coming from the South of Alor, village Musape. The sword is 63,5 cm long, no scabbard. Blade is 4,4 mm thick at the base. Attached Images Last edited by Sajen; 3rd October 2014 at 02:02 PM.

3rd October 2014, 04:07 PM	#5
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,212	Here two pictures from Alor warriors I just found by google. Attached Images

2nd October 2014, 11:18 PM	#1
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	comment from Karel Sirag <quote> On item #2, posted by Udo (aka Sentrad) on Sept. 11th, 2014: I am glad with the detailed photographs. Many, many details, I love it. As far I can see from these photographs (preferable one should feel it in the hand and even smell the natural origin of the materials!) it looks as it is genuine and a weapon with some age. But there are a few differences with what may be called 'the normal Har from Alor island'. Hilt: as far I can see, this is made of wood. Which is strange. I know only two other made of wood. The decoration running along the 'forehead' differs slightly and is a bit more crudely made than what you would expect from a professional carver. Also the 'eye' is different: the usual form is a circle with a slightly bulbous centre (often covered with a disc made from tin or lead) and not a flat disc. Concerning the metal ferrule at the base of the hilt: normally it is a ring of horn around the base to prevent cracking. Aside from these two examples, I have not seen any metal ferrule on typical Alor sword hilts. This is sometimes seen in Wetar swords, not common though. Blade: Mostly this is a straight one and more slender, a 'standard' import from Solor. Or, more rare, import from Southern Sulawesi (Rumbiah) with its typical rows of twistcore 'pamor'. These imported blades are often 'reshaped' by filing until obtaining the shape that the Alor people thought was their own tradition (passed on by their ancestors). I cannot see wether there is a brass peg inlaid along the back of the blade where it slopes down towards the tip. Most of the time (nine out of ten) it is present. Sheath: The wood used here I recognize the same as on one of my swords from Wetar (Opi), also the way of patination on the rattan, now flaked, I found on sheaths of Wetar swords. As already said in my notes before on April 1st, 2010, the disc shaped finial or 'foot' of the sheath of item #1 (and of #2, too!) is weird and unique. It is even more curious to see TWO of these popping up in the same collection! Provisional conservative conclusion: Because of the fact there are two pieces which have same features (wooden hilt with metal base, just a flat circle as 'eye', not 'standard' blades and rounded foot) and who differ from the 'normal' known swords from Alor, but who have, as far as can be seen from photographs, certain age and show use, it is possible this is a rather rare subspecies of the commonly known Har. That this is originating from Alor rather than from Wetar can be inferred from the carvings on both hilts as well as the sheath of item #1. As far as I know, Wetar Opi have plain hilts with no decoration nor eye, and have undecorated, somewhat wider scabbards. As explained in my former notes the decoration of the 'wrongka' of item #1 should be from the centre of the island. It is a riddle which I do not have any solution for yet. I may conclude this is an Alor sword which shows some Wetar influences. Import, immigration, marriage, trade, who knows? Having said this: This makes collecting Indonesian weaponry so interesting. If you, as a collector, want to find everything easily in a book, you better collect stamps. Karel Sirag <unquote>

3rd October 2014, 01:57 PM	#4
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,212	Maybe Udo can show some pictures from the smaller sword shown in post #8, this sword I've sold him years ago and coming from the same source.