Oman, Morocco or Zanzibar?

blue lander · 3rd April 2014, 04:28 PM

No, it must have ended weeks ago. I don't think anybody bought it though.

Jim McDougall · 3rd April 2014, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue lander

No, it must have ended weeks ago. I don't think anybody bought it though.

I am being advised that when these items do not sell in these particular auctions they are apparently automatically relisted. Did you check to ensure that neither of these two swords are presently listed in that auction?

While I very much appreciate the opportunity to see these items and use them in discussion, it is essential that we observe the rules here. For those reading who are not familiar, actually it is rule #1 (at the top of this page under the heading forum rules and regulations) which states items that are in current auctions or for sale are prohibited from being posted for discussion.

blue lander · 3rd April 2014, 10:25 PM

You're right, I had no idea they had been relisted. My apologies. If a mod could delete the photos I'd appreciate it.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 7th April 2014, 10:11 AM

It may be worth observing http://www.qucosa.de/fileadmin/data/..._02_athman.pdf for a comprehensive look at Swahili wood carving...which also mentions early settlers from North Africa...My search is aimed at identification of a Zanzibar Hub production centre (or not) for Nimcha hilts...

It seems apparent that the VIP style of Omani Zanzibari Ivory and Gold hilts were produced by artesans in Zanzibar, however, was there a manufacturing unit for the other well made sturdy Rosewood or Rhino Hilts with substantial ironwork guards?...

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 13th April 2014, 05:55 PM

Some comparisons in the Pommel of two Zanzibari Nimcha ~ a decorative design which appears to be some sort of leaf design...perhaps a herb?... in silver.

Shown also is a rough hewn copy probably Yemeni of the same motiff...

Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

Norman McCormick · 13th April 2014, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ibrahiim al Balooshi

Shown also is a rough hewn copy probably Yemeni of the same motiff...

The nimcha in question. http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=nimcha
Regards,
Norman.

Jim McDougall · 13th April 2014, 10:02 PM

I had not noticed the curious stylized pommel plate on these nimchas Ibrahiim, interesting element. The simplistic design here seems to recall the 'calyx' type flourish usually found on the back of blades right at the hilt where the blade enters. It seems an extension of the backstrap and is typically a 'leaf' type shape, characteristic on Central Asian weapons such as Khyber knives and pesh kabz.
Another stylized image would be the component on scabbard throat mounts of Yemeni sa'if which is often termed the 'aghreb' (=scorpion?). These mounts are apparently fashioned in Hyderabad in India, and of course well within the trade sphere to Arabia and further to Zanzibar.

The influences of Central Asian arms and those from India were of course well represented in Ottoman contexts with mercenary forces which were largely present in their forces.

Though highly stylized these sometimes roughly presented forms still carry the nuance of the tradition and symbolism on the more elegant examples of these arms. While this comparison is admittedly tenuous and speculative, it seems worthy of consideration.

The Schimmelbusch family was a dynasty of swordsmiths in Solingen from beginning of 17th century to end of the 19th. They began using the shooting star symbol in 1777, and these makers were apparently one of the more prolific suppliers of blades to Red Sea trade, which included Zanzibar. Like other Solingen producers, they of course only supplied blades, but not hilts

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 13th April 2014, 06:21 PM

Please see http://badger.uvm.edu/omeka/exhibits...02010/item/574 for an interesting Nimcha said to be the work of a German sword maker called Schimmelbusch.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi

7th April 2014, 10:11 AM	#4
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Nimcha Hilts ...Made in Zanzibar or ?? It may be worth observing http://www.qucosa.de/fileadmin/data/..._02_athman.pdf for a comprehensive look at Swahili wood carving...which also mentions early settlers from North Africa...My search is aimed at identification of a Zanzibar Hub production centre (or not) for Nimcha hilts... It seems apparent that the VIP style of Omani Zanzibari Ivory and Gold hilts were produced by artesans in Zanzibar, however, was there a manufacturing unit for the other well made sturdy Rosewood or Rhino Hilts with substantial ironwork guards?... Regards, Ibrahiim al Balooshi. Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 8th April 2014 at 05:22 AM.

13th April 2014, 05:55 PM	#5
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Some comparisons in the Pommel of two Zanzibari Nimcha ~ a decorative design which appears to be some sort of leaf design...perhaps a herb?... in silver. Shown also is a rough hewn copy probably Yemeni of the same motiff... Ibrahiim al Balooshi. Attached Images Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 13th April 2014 at 06:39 PM.

3rd April 2014, 04:28 PM	#1
blue lander Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 456	No, it must have ended weeks ago. I don't think anybody bought it though.

3rd April 2014, 10:25 PM	#3
blue lander Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 456	You're right, I had no idea they had been relisted. My apologies. If a mod could delete the photos I'd appreciate it.

13th April 2014, 10:02 PM	#7
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,589	I had not noticed the curious stylized pommel plate on these nimchas Ibrahiim, interesting element. The simplistic design here seems to recall the 'calyx' type flourish usually found on the back of blades right at the hilt where the blade enters. It seems an extension of the backstrap and is typically a 'leaf' type shape, characteristic on Central Asian weapons such as Khyber knives and pesh kabz. Another stylized image would be the component on scabbard throat mounts of Yemeni sa'if which is often termed the 'aghreb' (=scorpion?). These mounts are apparently fashioned in Hyderabad in India, and of course well within the trade sphere to Arabia and further to Zanzibar. The influences of Central Asian arms and those from India were of course well represented in Ottoman contexts with mercenary forces which were largely present in their forces. Though highly stylized these sometimes roughly presented forms still carry the nuance of the tradition and symbolism on the more elegant examples of these arms. While this comparison is admittedly tenuous and speculative, it seems worthy of consideration. The Schimmelbusch family was a dynasty of swordsmiths in Solingen from beginning of 17th century to end of the 19th. They began using the shooting star symbol in 1777, and these makers were apparently one of the more prolific suppliers of blades to Red Sea trade, which included Zanzibar. Like other Solingen producers, they of course only supplied blades, but not hilts

13th April 2014, 06:21 PM	#8
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Please see http://badger.uvm.edu/omeka/exhibits...02010/item/574 for an interesting Nimcha said to be the work of a German sword maker called Schimmelbusch. Ibrahiim al Balooshi