Incendiary quarrels/arrows/crossbow bolts

M ELEY · 21st March 2014, 01:02 AM

Spectacular pics, Michael!!! The Italian ones do very closely resemble the one I inquired about on the other thread! Do you have a prospective date on the last pieces posted? 17th-18th c.? or earlier? Thanks again!
Mark

Matchlock · 21st March 2014, 11:29 AM

Hi Mark,

The caption reads that the first two grenades are dated to ca. 1700, the third 18th c., the fourth and sixth 18th/19th c., and #6 is 18th c.

Best,
Michael

Matchlock · 21st March 2014, 12:27 PM

Here is an islamic hand grenade, ca. 7th to 9th c. AD, a Fatimidian (Egyptian) grenade of ca. 900-1200 AD and a few modern items, together with some older stuff.

m

Matchlock · 23rd March 2014, 07:40 PM

I also found these iron hand grenades in an auction catalog of 2011, 10 cm diameter, probably 18th or 19th c.

m

Marcus den toom · 23rd March 2014, 07:42 PM

Some pictures of my Pechkranze, they are some very interesting objects

I am very interested to learn why the fabric is at some places faintly red??

Marcus den toom · 23rd March 2014, 07:42 PM

and some more

Marcus den toom · 23rd March 2014, 09:07 PM

This area is even more clear, some parts of the fabric is red...
Maybe these qouites where made of reused fabric? Or is there a substance which would be used on such an item that would turn this fabric red?

Andi · 23rd March 2014, 10:07 PM

Hello Marcus ten toom! Thank you for this phantastic images. Where you have taken them?
Regarding the red fabric I think that most probably the fabric was taken from worn garments. There is absolutely no need to weave a fabric especially for the quoits. In former times fabrics had a much higher value compared to modern times, especially when no automatic machines were available for fibre processing, spinning, weaving, dyeing and sewing. From archaeological excavations many examples for reused worn garments are present such as toilet papers, fillings of blind building structures, relic packings and decoration, textile appliqué on newer garments, caulk material for ships and so on.. - But what makes me wonder is the red colour. In former times dyeing linen in red colour was very difficult, this could be affordable by an aristocratic, clerical or noble elite.
But the red colour as result of a chemical process with the incendiary matters would be an interesting question.

21st March 2014, 12:27 PM	#3
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Here is an islamic hand grenade, ca. 7th to 9th c. AD, a Fatimidian (Egyptian) grenade of ca. 900-1200 AD and a few modern items, together with some older stuff. m Attached Images

23rd March 2014, 07:40 PM	#4
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	I also found these iron hand grenades in an auction catalog of 2011, 10 cm diameter, probably 18th or 19th c. m Attached Images

21st March 2014, 01:02 AM	#1
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,167	Spectacular pics, Michael!!! The Italian ones do very closely resemble the one I inquired about on the other thread! Do you have a prospective date on the last pieces posted? 17th-18th c.? or earlier? Thanks again! Mark

21st March 2014, 11:29 AM	#2
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	Hi Mark, The caption reads that the first two grenades are dated to ca. 1700, the third 18th c., the fourth and sixth 18th/19th c., and #6 is 18th c. Best, Michael

23rd March 2014, 07:42 PM	#5
Marcus den toom Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 535	Some pictures of my Pechkranze, they are some very interesting objects I am very interested to learn why the fabric is at some places faintly red??

23rd March 2014, 09:07 PM	#7
Marcus den toom Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 535	This area is even more clear, some parts of the fabric is red... Maybe these qouites where made of reused fabric? Or is there a substance which would be used on such an item that would turn this fabric red?

23rd March 2014, 10:07 PM	#8
Andi Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Halstenbek, Germany Posts: 203	Hello Marcus ten toom! Thank you for this phantastic images. Where you have taken them? Regarding the red fabric I think that most probably the fabric was taken from worn garments. There is absolutely no need to weave a fabric especially for the quoits. In former times fabrics had a much higher value compared to modern times, especially when no automatic machines were available for fibre processing, spinning, weaving, dyeing and sewing. From archaeological excavations many examples for reused worn garments are present such as toilet papers, fillings of blind building structures, relic packings and decoration, textile appliqué on newer garments, caulk material for ships and so on.. - But what makes me wonder is the red colour. In former times dyeing linen in red colour was very difficult, this could be affordable by an aristocratic, clerical or noble elite. But the red colour as result of a chemical process with the incendiary matters would be an interesting question.