Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Keris Warung Kopi
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 29th December 2013, 08:47 PM   #1
Timo Nieminen
Member
 
Timo Nieminen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 422
Default

Since "keris" is a conventional taxonomic label, we are not free of collective opinion. For something to be a "real" keris, it must meet the requirements of the definition; some of these have been noted by Vandoo above. But here there is some plasticity.

1. Does a keris need to be forged? If the maker grinds the blade from a slab of steel, can it be a real keris?

2. Can anybody make a keris? Can a keris be made everywhere in the world, or only in certain places? I.e., does "keris" have similar status to "nihonto" ("real" Japanese sword)?

3. What degree of variation is permitted before it ceases to be a keris?

From a weapons-collecting point of view, a key point is functionality as a weapon or bladed tool. This provides no answer for the three questions above. So it is insufficient for keris. (It is also insufficient for "nihonto".) Where the type of object in question is still in modern use, but the main use is not as a weapon or cutting tool (i.e., the main use is not actually cutting or stabbing things, or training to cut/stab things), perhaps physical function can mislead us. Based on physical function, I would not call a Bali tourist keris with an unsharpened sheet metal blade with painted-on "pamor" a real keris. To a weapons collector, it isn't "real" - it isn't a weapon. But perhaps it could be to a modern keris user. I don't know the answer, but am interested. So:

4. Can a "non-weapon" keris be "real"?
Timo Nieminen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th December 2013, 11:30 PM   #2
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,255
Default

Hello Timo,

Quote:
From a weapons-collecting point of view, a key point is functionality as a weapon or bladed tool. This provides no answer for the three questions above. So it is insufficient for keris. (It is also insufficient for "nihonto".) Where the type of object in question is still in modern use, but the main use is not as a weapon or cutting tool (i.e., the main use is not actually cutting or stabbing things, or training to cut/stab things), perhaps physical function can mislead us. Based on physical function, I would not call a Bali tourist keris with an unsharpened sheet metal blade with painted-on "pamor" a real keris. To a weapons collector, it isn't "real" - it isn't a weapon. But perhaps it could be to a modern keris user. I don't know the answer, but am interested. So:

4. Can a "non-weapon" keris be "real"?
If we accept a Jawa-centric cultural approach to things keris, the weapon function has certainly not been a major consideration during the last centuries. While in other keris cultures the weapon function did not ceased (at least as much as colonial powers allowed and arguably well into modern times), other factors would have been just as important: esteemed cultural icon, symbol of manhood, display of status, group-connecting pusaka, etc.

If anything, a keris being weapon is currently the least acknowledged (if not downright disputed) function/meaning by the general populace in today's "keris-bearing" societies. A toy-like prop is good enough to represent as a wedding keris; even if you can afford more you better spend it on gifts, food, offerings, etc.

Regards,
Kai
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.