German hackbut barrel

Matchlock · 20th December 2013, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matchlock

Hi Marcus,
On the underside of the rear barrel base there ought to be (or may be missing) a round loop for a transversal stock pin; the other, forward pin went thru the hole in the hook.
Best,
Michael

As there obviously was no side view provided by the auction house I cannot tell whether the rear loop is still there or not.

What date was that Bonhams sale? That barrel is mid-16th c., possibly Italian or French, the dovetailed pan is missing.

Best,
m

Marcus den toom · 20th December 2013, 06:08 PM

it was the sale on 30november in 2011 (london).

I thought that rectangular "hooks" on these barrels where made earlier?

Matchlock · 20th December 2013, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcus den toom

it was the sale on 30november in 2011 (london).

I thought that rectangular "hooks" on these barrels where made earlier?

This wall hook should actually not be called 'rectangular'; it's rather rounded, basically very much like the one on that Czerny's barrel, and figured as a sea monster.
As I have tried to state several times, the earliest - and actually rectangular - wall hooks on barrels seem to have appeared in ca. 1430; they evolved a certain degree of staging after ca. 1450, and after ca. 1510-15 they seem to have taken on rounded (Renaissance-type) shapes.
Wall hooks had normally disappeared by ca. 1600 but are found as late as the second half of the 18th c. (!!!) on special types of wallgun barrels.

Best,
Michael

Matchlock · 25th December 2013, 06:00 PM

Although the snap tinderlock and swiveling pan cover are missing, the finely preserved lime wood or pear wood full stock will convey a good impression of what such pieces would look like when complete.
The second, the blackened fir wood (!) stock heavily wormed, dry rotten and probably not to be saved, the lock mechanism also missing, I photographed in the famous Oberhausmuseum Passau, Lower Bavaria, a bit over 100 km east of where I live.
Regarding the stock, I must add that I offered them to consolidate and conserve it right at my first visit there some 35 years ago. They did not show the least interest though I warned them that it would dissolve before their very eyes. When I got there again a few years later, they had soaked it in crude linseed oil thru and thru, resulting in severe wood losses. That was a final treatment, nothing can be done about it any more. All it is now is a sticky, almost amorphous mass. I would have given that stock hundreds of injections of a hot watery solution of bone glue for days and weeks, and the surface would have been unharmed and unchanged. Museums ...

Anyway, you remember I hold some fine Nuremberg hagbut/haquebut/hackbut barrels coming from that museum during WW II in my collection.

Also attached find a snap tinderlock, Nuremberg, ca. 1540, made by Hans Koler (the hourglass mark should be attributed to him), of exactly the type missing from the Stockholm and Passau pieces. The wing nut is missing from the serpentine. That lock is preserved in the Bavarian Army Museum Ingolstadt, 30 km from my home; it belongs to an arquebus of ca. 1540, the barrel marked by Hans Mörl, who shared a workshop with Hans Koler in 1537. The museum staff do not realize (or even believe) that the mechanism belongs to the gun ...

Best,
Michael

Matchlock · 25th December 2013, 06:04 PM

The snap tinderlock mechanism.

Marcus den toom · 27th December 2013, 02:15 PM

Thanks Michael,

Do you also have a picture of the inside of this mechanism?

I imagine a spring on top holding the sear in place rather than underneath the sear like those in other matchlocks?

edit:
O wait, i already see the spring attachement inside the lockplate on one of your pictures. The spring was situated underneath the sear, only at the other side of the pivoting point (i think?)

Matchlock · 27th December 2013, 02:29 PM

No, Marcus,

If I had one I had posted it, it is in a class case that the BAM will open for nobody. But from what I can see the spring must be located under the sear, just like on a wheellock mechanism. Your editing thought was pefectly right!

I attach images of the similarly construed lock of my Tusco-Emilian (Brescia) snap-tinderlock arquebus of ca. 1525-30, the serpentine shaped as a seahorse.

m

25th December 2013, 06:00 PM	#4
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	A Good Nuremberg Hackbut, ca. 1540, in the Army Museum Stockholm Although the snap tinderlock and swiveling pan cover are missing, the finely preserved lime wood or pear wood full stock will convey a good impression of what such pieces would look like when complete. The second, the blackened fir wood (!) stock heavily wormed, dry rotten and probably not to be saved, the lock mechanism also missing, I photographed in the famous Oberhausmuseum Passau, Lower Bavaria, a bit over 100 km east of where I live. Regarding the stock, I must add that I offered them to consolidate and conserve it right at my first visit there some 35 years ago. They did not show the least interest though I warned them that it would dissolve before their very eyes. When I got there again a few years later, they had soaked it in crude linseed oil thru and thru, resulting in severe wood losses. That was a final treatment, nothing can be done about it any more. All it is now is a sticky, almost amorphous mass. I would have given that stock hundreds of injections of a hot watery solution of bone glue for days and weeks, and the surface would have been unharmed and unchanged. Museums ... Anyway, you remember I hold some fine Nuremberg hagbut/haquebut/hackbut barrels coming from that museum during WW II in my collection. Also attached find a snap tinderlock, Nuremberg, ca. 1540, made by Hans Koler (the hourglass mark should be attributed to him), of exactly the type missing from the Stockholm and Passau pieces. The wing nut is missing from the serpentine. That lock is preserved in the Bavarian Army Museum Ingolstadt, 30 km from my home; it belongs to an arquebus of ca. 1540, the barrel marked by Hans Mörl, who shared a workshop with Hans Koler in 1537. The museum staff do not realize (or even believe) that the mechanism belongs to the gun ... Best, Michael Attached Images Last edited by Matchlock; 26th December 2013 at 02:57 PM.

25th December 2013, 06:04 PM	#5
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	The snap tinderlock mechanism. Attached Images

27th December 2013, 02:29 PM	#7
Matchlock (deceased) Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Bavaria, Germany - the center of 15th and 16th century gunmaking Posts: 4,310	No, Marcus, If I had one I had posted it, it is in a class case that the BAM will open for nobody. But from what I can see the spring must be located under the sear, just like on a wheellock mechanism. Your editing thought was pefectly right! I attach images of the similarly construed lock of my Tusco-Emilian (Brescia) snap-tinderlock arquebus of ca. 1525-30, the serpentine shaped as a seahorse. m Attached Images

20th December 2013, 06:08 PM	#2
Marcus den toom Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 535	it was the sale on 30november in 2011 (london). I thought that rectangular "hooks" on these barrels where made earlier?

27th December 2013, 02:15 PM	#6
Marcus den toom Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 535	Thanks Michael, Do you also have a picture of the inside of this mechanism? I imagine a spring on top holding the sear in place rather than underneath the sear like those in other matchlocks? edit: O wait, i already see the spring attachement inside the lockplate on one of your pictures. The spring was situated underneath the sear, only at the other side of the pivoting point (i think?)