Unknown sword! Possibly Sumatran Battak with Pamor?

Sajen · 11th October 2013, 08:24 PM

Back to the sword in question. My best guess: an old/antique javanese sword blade in newly made fittings. The oil you smell will be keris oil.

Regards,

Detlef

Henk · 11th October 2013, 09:39 PM

It is a pedang in a new dress. Not too bad.

William.m · 12th October 2013, 09:35 PM

Thank you to everybody who contributed to the thread!

The scented oil is really quite nice and I have found some on ebay, which I will buy as it is much nicer than choji oil.

A. G. Maisey · 13th October 2013, 11:57 AM

I don't have much to add to what has already been said, except that I can possibly be a little more definite about what I say.

This is a Javanese pedang blade, close examination will show that it predates 1850, the dress will be found to be from Javanese sandalwood (unscented). The style of dress is popular in Central Jawa, especially Solo.

It is important to understand that for the Javanese people, the spiritual value of any item of tosan aji is contained in the blade, not in the dress. For a collector of tosan aji the items of dress, hilt, scabbard etc., can certainly have a value when they are old or antique, most particularly when they are also of good quality, but very often the old Javanese weapons actually used in war lack their scabbards, and the hilts are frequently very utilitarian. So, what has happened is that old blades were frequently re-dressed in plain good quality wooden dress, or as often happened when pedang were still sometimes worn as items of dress in parades & etc., they were re-dressed in gold or silver.

Then there is the fact that many families have inherited weapons that they wish to keep and as a mark of respect they will re-dress the blade in a simple style to replace old and damaged original dress.

The hilt and scabbard that have been fitted to this blade appear to be of quite nice quality, whether the quality is as good as it appears to be will depend very largely upon two things:- firstly, is the scabbard carved from an unjointed piece of wood, that is, is there no join along the edges of the scabbard, and secondly, does the fit and finish give evidence of careful craftsmanship.

As Detlef has advised, the oil will be keris oil. I strongly recommend that the oil that originates in Indonesia not be used, as this has a coconut oil base that is not particularly wonderful for long term storage. It is far better to make your own oil using sandalwood or some other fragrance, such as jasmine and a base of medicinal paraffin. If oil is used, it will eventually stain the scabbard, so it is best not to store the oiled blade in the scabbard but to wrap it in plastic after oiling and store it out of the scabbard.

This is actually a pretty nice pedang.

kronckew · 13th October 2013, 04:26 PM

(
medicinal paraffin = mineral oil = unscented baby oil. (see again AGM's recipe in the other linked post)

of course if you are going to scent it, no need to hunt for the illusive unscented baby oil. the scented one is just fine if you add essential flower oils

)

i recently received a pair of swords from the phillipenes that were covered in coconut oil & wrapped in plastic, i initially thought it was vaseline, so i removed it and substituted a nicely anise scented mineral oil based multi-purpose product invented by the germans in the latter 19th century for steel, wood, leather preservation and cleaning... it even can be used as a wound antiseptic, it's anti-fungal and antibacterial. forget gurkhas feeling your shoe laces. they could tell by smell long before...

i hope the spirits of the 2 blades like it.

drac2k · 13th October 2013, 07:00 PM

Any chance one might get the recipe ?????

A. G. Maisey · 13th October 2013, 09:27 PM

In Australia medicinal paraffin is also sold as medicinal paraffin, which it seems is a laxative.

I'm pretty sure I've given this recipe here before, but to save looking:-

50% medicinal parafin, 45% sandalwood oil, 5% kenanga oil. Proportions are not critical.

I use a German synthetic sandalwood oil, and natural kenanga oil. Its probably impossible to buy kenanga oil outside of Indonesia. However, it is quite acceptable to use other oils to give the perfume --- jasmine, white rose, rose etc., etc. Main thing is that it is a pleasing smell. In Jawa sandalwood is pretty wide spread in its use, but sandalwood has a lot of variations, and they all smell different.

Kenanga oil is related to, but is not, ylang-ylang. I think , from memory, that kenanga is from the young flower, ylang-ylang is from the mature flower.

Light machine oil, such as sewing machine oil, also works well as a base.

13th October 2013, 04:26 PM	#5
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,215	( medicinal paraffin = mineral oil = unscented baby oil. (see again AGM's recipe in the other linked post) of course if you are going to scent it, no need to hunt for the illusive unscented baby oil. the scented one is just fine if you add essential flower oils ) i recently received a pair of swords from the phillipenes that were covered in coconut oil & wrapped in plastic, i initially thought it was vaseline, so i removed it and substituted a nicely anise scented mineral oil based multi-purpose product invented by the germans in the latter 19th century for steel, wood, leather preservation and cleaning... it even can be used as a wound antiseptic, it's anti-fungal and antibacterial. forget gurkhas feeling your shoe laces. they could tell by smell long before... i hope the spirits of the 2 blades like it. Last edited by kronckew; 13th October 2013 at 04:43 PM.

11th October 2013, 08:24 PM	#1
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,165	Back to the sword in question. My best guess: an old/antique javanese sword blade in newly made fittings. The oil you smell will be keris oil. Regards, Detlef

11th October 2013, 09:39 PM	#2
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	It is a pedang in a new dress. Not too bad.

12th October 2013, 09:35 PM	#3
William.m Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: England Posts: 104	Thank you to everybody who contributed to the thread! The scented oil is really quite nice and I have found some on ebay, which I will buy as it is much nicer than choji oil.

13th October 2013, 11:57 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	I don't have much to add to what has already been said, except that I can possibly be a little more definite about what I say. This is a Javanese pedang blade, close examination will show that it predates 1850, the dress will be found to be from Javanese sandalwood (unscented). The style of dress is popular in Central Jawa, especially Solo. It is important to understand that for the Javanese people, the spiritual value of any item of tosan aji is contained in the blade, not in the dress. For a collector of tosan aji the items of dress, hilt, scabbard etc., can certainly have a value when they are old or antique, most particularly when they are also of good quality, but very often the old Javanese weapons actually used in war lack their scabbards, and the hilts are frequently very utilitarian. So, what has happened is that old blades were frequently re-dressed in plain good quality wooden dress, or as often happened when pedang were still sometimes worn as items of dress in parades & etc., they were re-dressed in gold or silver. Then there is the fact that many families have inherited weapons that they wish to keep and as a mark of respect they will re-dress the blade in a simple style to replace old and damaged original dress. The hilt and scabbard that have been fitted to this blade appear to be of quite nice quality, whether the quality is as good as it appears to be will depend very largely upon two things:- firstly, is the scabbard carved from an unjointed piece of wood, that is, is there no join along the edges of the scabbard, and secondly, does the fit and finish give evidence of careful craftsmanship. As Detlef has advised, the oil will be keris oil. I strongly recommend that the oil that originates in Indonesia not be used, as this has a coconut oil base that is not particularly wonderful for long term storage. It is far better to make your own oil using sandalwood or some other fragrance, such as jasmine and a base of medicinal paraffin. If oil is used, it will eventually stain the scabbard, so it is best not to store the oiled blade in the scabbard but to wrap it in plastic after oiling and store it out of the scabbard. This is actually a pretty nice pedang.

13th October 2013, 07:00 PM	#6
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,255	Any chance one might get the recipe ?????

13th October 2013, 09:27 PM	#7
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	In Australia medicinal paraffin is also sold as medicinal paraffin, which it seems is a laxative. I'm pretty sure I've given this recipe here before, but to save looking:- 50% medicinal parafin, 45% sandalwood oil, 5% kenanga oil. Proportions are not critical. I use a German synthetic sandalwood oil, and natural kenanga oil. Its probably impossible to buy kenanga oil outside of Indonesia. However, it is quite acceptable to use other oils to give the perfume --- jasmine, white rose, rose etc., etc. Main thing is that it is a pleasing smell. In Jawa sandalwood is pretty wide spread in its use, but sandalwood has a lot of variations, and they all smell different. Kenanga oil is related to, but is not, ylang-ylang. I think , from memory, that kenanga is from the young flower, ylang-ylang is from the mature flower. Light machine oil, such as sewing machine oil, also works well as a base.