INDONESIAN KERIS: Aesthetic and Philosophical Meaning

A. G. Maisey · 1st May 2013, 10:24 PM

Ariel, as I have already remarked:- I enjoy reading your posts; you have a style that is quite unique in this Forum and that does make a change from the usual warm, touchy-feely comradeship that characterises most participants in our discussions here. I like a little bit of colour in discussion. There is nothing quite so refreshing as seeing a CEO begin to froth at the mouth during a board meeting because he feels some other member of the board has slighted him. Even though some of us might sound like a CEO at times, I'm not suggesting that you, nor any of us here are in fact CEO's or in attendance at a board meeting, but sometimes vitriol can become a source of amusement.

If one thing in this world is true, it is that we can never change the behaviour of another person, but we can change our own.

I do apologise to you for my overly long posts. I often find that I need to make the Mark Twain plea:- "forgive me for the long letter, I did not have time to write a short one". I'm sure that as an experienced writer you would understand exactly the problems of presentation that is both accurate and concise, and since we are relaxing here, not producing words in hope of financial reward, nor enhancement of reputation, I am equally sure you will forgive my verbosity.

However, had my previous post dealing with societal variation been shorter, you might have read it, and having read it you may have given consideration to the points I attempted to make, and possibly even have come to an understanding of those points. Clearly this did not happen, for had you considered what I presented in that post, being the intelligent, educated man that you are, you would have realised that the standards of behaviour that apply in New York, London, and even here in the antipodes, are not necessarily the standards of behaviour that apply in other places on earth. Most certainly, the standards that you consider to be proper are not necessarily the standards that are considered to be proper in Jawa.

Let me give you an example:- let us imagine that you have entered the Golden Arches to indulge yourself in a Big Mac; in New York, or anywhere else in the conglomerate of western societies, you would expect that payment for your Big Mac offered with the left hand would be gratefully accepted, and rightly so. But if you offered payment with the left hand in Jawa you would find that the vast bulk of well-mannered people in that part of the world would refuse your payment and indicate for you to place it on the counter. It goes further than this:- if you attempted to accept your change with your left hand it could well be tossed in your general direction.
You see, in Jawa, and a number of other places, the left hand is considered to be foul, and may not be used to either give or receive; to do so indicates that you are either incredibly ill-mannered or simply a fool and not to be accorded the respect due to a civilised person. To proffer the left hand to another person is deemed to be not only ill-mannered, but in some circumstances may be considered an insult that could require further action.

You see Ariel, your standards, and I guess mine also, when I am in my home country are quite different to the standards of people who live in different societies to our own.

Because of this we must never pass judgement upon what is acceptable behaviour in some other society by measuring that behaviour against our own standards.

So where am I going with this?

Once again you have decided that you are qualified to arbitrate upon standards of behaviour:-

"--- any empu you have in mind, - no personal achievements in a particular professional area are an excuse of rude behavior."

Regrettably Ariel, in this instance you are quite incorrect; that which you have determined is rude behaviour would not be considered so in the society where we find Javanese empus --- any more so than your payment for a Big Mac offered with your left hand would be considered impolite in New York.

May I most humbly suggest that before you pass judgement upon what is correct behaviour in a society that differs from your own, that you spend just a little time in gaining some knowledge of that society.

Bjorn · 1st May 2013, 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

May I most humbly suggest that before you pass judgement upon what is correct behaviour in a society that differs from your own, that you spend just a little time in gaining some knowledge of that society.

In light of the above: I am in the process of reading Mysticism in Java: Ideology in Indonesia. This book covers the Javanese mindset in detail and would be an interesting read for anyone wanting to learn more about Javanese society.

A. G. Maisey · 1st May 2013, 11:14 PM

Mulder is a good start, Yuuzan. I find him very easy to read, but he tends to generalise a bit too much, which is OK as long as we can recognise that what he puts forth is not necessarily applicable in all cases. Additionally there is a distinct focus on kejawen which tends to orientate this particular writing towards a distinct segment of society.

In attempts at understanding Javanese society from published text Geertz is probably indispensable. "Religion of Java" was written a long time ago, but much of what it presents is timeless. Possibly not as easy to read as Mulder, but still, not difficult for a layman.

David · 2nd May 2013, 02:37 AM

Thanks for the suggestion Alan. I have read Mulder and found it very useful information, but i can understand what you mean in regards to his focus on kejawen. I will look into Geertz.

A. G. Maisey · 2nd May 2013, 03:31 AM

There's another author you may care to consider too David: Koentjaraningrat, "Javanese Culture".

As with Geertz and Mulder, its a classic, and it has copped its fair share of criticism from other authorities, but it does have the advantage of being written by an academic with an inside view, rather than by somebody who was not born into the culture.

There has been a lot written on Javanese culture and society, even Raffles is still worth a read, because even now, 200 years later, some of what he reports can still be related to. There's probably no real substitute for being a part of the society, but these books we're looking at are certainly a very good start to getting a handle on how the place works, and what is and is not acceptable.

David · 2nd May 2013, 05:29 AM

Thanks Alan. I'm reading Ricklefs' The Seen and Unseen Worlds in Java right now, but i will look into the others next. It looks like you can read Raffles' History of Java for free online.

http://archive.org/details/historyjava00unkngoog

A. G. Maisey · 2nd May 2013, 06:55 AM

Thank you Ariel, for taking the time to make a response when you are under pressure. I do understand:- wives, grandchildren and significant others can really be quite demanding at times.

I live in The Land of Oz, not because I choose to, but because I am an Australian. Although I do have a part of my left foot planted firmly in Jawa, it is not really a place I would choose to live, particularly as I grow older. Javanese villages, both urban and rural tend not to be mystical, but rather to be hotbeds of factions, intrigues, slander and gossip. They are places where the elected government official who has responsibility for the good order and political safety of the households under his administration has the right to enter any household at any time, day or night if his entry is in the best interests of the community. I much prefer to live in Oz where people need a search warrant before they can search my house. Jawa, indeed Indonesia in general is a wonderful place to visit ---

Body language is one thing that can be difficult for an outsider to come to terms with, and I used the left hand example as one that usually surprises, sometimes shocks people who are unaware of it, especially when one explains why nobody in Jawa possesses a left hand. I understand that in many parts of India the left hand is equally as unloved, but for entirely different reasons.

The head touching thing is another Javanese no-no, and it is not so long ago that it was deemed to be adequate reason to kill a person.

Jawa really should not be thought of Muslim, which could well be thought a very peculiar thing to say, when Indonesia is the most populous Muslim nation in the world. The truth of the matter is the vast bulk of Javanese people --- and here I mean people who live in The land of Jawa, not upon the Island of Jawa --- remain faithful to their indigenous belief system. When Indonesia replaced the old Dutch colonial rule, it was decided that everybody could follow the religion of their choice and had the freedom to worship their own God, but the indigenous belief system was not recognised as a religion, so people who could not, or who did not want to identify as Buddhist, Hindu, Christian --- or whatever--- mostly jumped on the Muslim bandwagon and became what we call "Islam KTP" = "Islam kartu penduduk" = "Islam according to identity card". Maybe a bit like a lot of people in England, and Australia for that matter, are CofE. These non-religious people are sometimes referred to as "Abangan".Even the people who do consider themselves Muslim are very often Kejawen; the actual number of hard-core, mainline Muslims is very small, and they tend to be made the butt of humour by many other Javanese.

Still, with all that said, Islam has had a deep and a lasting effect upon the way in which the keris is understood at the present time. But that's a different story.

Enjoy your visit Ariel, and remind those parents of your grandchildren that visits are two way streets. We senior people are entitled to dictate terms to those who follow. Its one of the privileges of living long enough to do so.

David,

yes, there is some remarkably good stuff online now, have a look at Sumastuti.

ariel · 2nd May 2013, 05:23 AM

Alan,
I am quite familiar with the peculiarities of nonverbal communication, from showing soles of your shoes in Iran, to patting somebody else's head in Thailand, to showing the A-OK sign (middle finger and thumb forming an O) in Latin America. Believe me, I even know why in the Muslim Jawa offering something with your left hand is considered an insult :-)

I do not have time for a detailed response: we are packing like crazy for a very long trip, and I am on a 5 minute break allocated by She Who Must Be Obeyed.

In brief, I can see why you live in Australia, where you are just Alan, and not in some mystical Jawanese village where someone who can make a good keris is considered to be a demigod with a license to do whatever his left foot wishes:-)

I may return to this discussion later on. Sorry, don't intend to be rude, but visiting grandkids is more important than stories about sharp and pointy thingies.

Best wishes.

1st May 2013, 10:24 PM	#1
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	Ariel, as I have already remarked:- I enjoy reading your posts; you have a style that is quite unique in this Forum and that does make a change from the usual warm, touchy-feely comradeship that characterises most participants in our discussions here. I like a little bit of colour in discussion. There is nothing quite so refreshing as seeing a CEO begin to froth at the mouth during a board meeting because he feels some other member of the board has slighted him. Even though some of us might sound like a CEO at times, I'm not suggesting that you, nor any of us here are in fact CEO's or in attendance at a board meeting, but sometimes vitriol can become a source of amusement. If one thing in this world is true, it is that we can never change the behaviour of another person, but we can change our own. I do apologise to you for my overly long posts. I often find that I need to make the Mark Twain plea:- "forgive me for the long letter, I did not have time to write a short one". I'm sure that as an experienced writer you would understand exactly the problems of presentation that is both accurate and concise, and since we are relaxing here, not producing words in hope of financial reward, nor enhancement of reputation, I am equally sure you will forgive my verbosity. However, had my previous post dealing with societal variation been shorter, you might have read it, and having read it you may have given consideration to the points I attempted to make, and possibly even have come to an understanding of those points. Clearly this did not happen, for had you considered what I presented in that post, being the intelligent, educated man that you are, you would have realised that the standards of behaviour that apply in New York, London, and even here in the antipodes, are not necessarily the standards of behaviour that apply in other places on earth. Most certainly, the standards that you consider to be proper are not necessarily the standards that are considered to be proper in Jawa. Let me give you an example:- let us imagine that you have entered the Golden Arches to indulge yourself in a Big Mac; in New York, or anywhere else in the conglomerate of western societies, you would expect that payment for your Big Mac offered with the left hand would be gratefully accepted, and rightly so. But if you offered payment with the left hand in Jawa you would find that the vast bulk of well-mannered people in that part of the world would refuse your payment and indicate for you to place it on the counter. It goes further than this:- if you attempted to accept your change with your left hand it could well be tossed in your general direction. You see, in Jawa, and a number of other places, the left hand is considered to be foul, and may not be used to either give or receive; to do so indicates that you are either incredibly ill-mannered or simply a fool and not to be accorded the respect due to a civilised person. To proffer the left hand to another person is deemed to be not only ill-mannered, but in some circumstances may be considered an insult that could require further action. You see Ariel, your standards, and I guess mine also, when I am in my home country are quite different to the standards of people who live in different societies to our own. Because of this we must never pass judgement upon what is acceptable behaviour in some other society by measuring that behaviour against our own standards. So where am I going with this? Once again you have decided that you are qualified to arbitrate upon standards of behaviour:- "--- any empu you have in mind, - no personal achievements in a particular professional area are an excuse of rude behavior." Regrettably Ariel, in this instance you are quite incorrect; that which you have determined is rude behaviour would not be considered so in the society where we find Javanese empus --- any more so than your payment for a Big Mac offered with your left hand would be considered impolite in New York. May I most humbly suggest that before you pass judgement upon what is correct behaviour in a society that differs from your own, that you spend just a little time in gaining some knowledge of that society. Last edited by A. G. Maisey; 1st May 2013 at 11:19 PM. Reason: punctuation

1st May 2013, 11:14 PM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	Mulder is a good start, Yuuzan. I find him very easy to read, but he tends to generalise a bit too much, which is OK as long as we can recognise that what he puts forth is not necessarily applicable in all cases. Additionally there is a distinct focus on kejawen which tends to orientate this particular writing towards a distinct segment of society. In attempts at understanding Javanese society from published text Geertz is probably indispensable. "Religion of Java" was written a long time ago, but much of what it presents is timeless. Possibly not as easy to read as Mulder, but still, not difficult for a layman.

2nd May 2013, 02:37 AM	#4
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Thanks for the suggestion Alan. I have read Mulder and found it very useful information, but i can understand what you mean in regards to his focus on kejawen. I will look into Geertz.

2nd May 2013, 03:31 AM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	There's another author you may care to consider too David: Koentjaraningrat, "Javanese Culture". As with Geertz and Mulder, its a classic, and it has copped its fair share of criticism from other authorities, but it does have the advantage of being written by an academic with an inside view, rather than by somebody who was not born into the culture. There has been a lot written on Javanese culture and society, even Raffles is still worth a read, because even now, 200 years later, some of what he reports can still be related to. There's probably no real substitute for being a part of the society, but these books we're looking at are certainly a very good start to getting a handle on how the place works, and what is and is not acceptable.

2nd May 2013, 05:29 AM	#6
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,211	Thanks Alan. I'm reading Ricklefs' The Seen and Unseen Worlds in Java right now, but i will look into the others next. It looks like you can read Raffles' History of Java for free online. http://archive.org/details/historyjava00unkngoog

2nd May 2013, 06:55 AM	#7
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	Thank you Ariel, for taking the time to make a response when you are under pressure. I do understand:- wives, grandchildren and significant others can really be quite demanding at times. I live in The Land of Oz, not because I choose to, but because I am an Australian. Although I do have a part of my left foot planted firmly in Jawa, it is not really a place I would choose to live, particularly as I grow older. Javanese villages, both urban and rural tend not to be mystical, but rather to be hotbeds of factions, intrigues, slander and gossip. They are places where the elected government official who has responsibility for the good order and political safety of the households under his administration has the right to enter any household at any time, day or night if his entry is in the best interests of the community. I much prefer to live in Oz where people need a search warrant before they can search my house. Jawa, indeed Indonesia in general is a wonderful place to visit --- Body language is one thing that can be difficult for an outsider to come to terms with, and I used the left hand example as one that usually surprises, sometimes shocks people who are unaware of it, especially when one explains why nobody in Jawa possesses a left hand. I understand that in many parts of India the left hand is equally as unloved, but for entirely different reasons. The head touching thing is another Javanese no-no, and it is not so long ago that it was deemed to be adequate reason to kill a person. Jawa really should not be thought of Muslim, which could well be thought a very peculiar thing to say, when Indonesia is the most populous Muslim nation in the world. The truth of the matter is the vast bulk of Javanese people --- and here I mean people who live in The land of Jawa, not upon the Island of Jawa --- remain faithful to their indigenous belief system. When Indonesia replaced the old Dutch colonial rule, it was decided that everybody could follow the religion of their choice and had the freedom to worship their own God, but the indigenous belief system was not recognised as a religion, so people who could not, or who did not want to identify as Buddhist, Hindu, Christian --- or whatever--- mostly jumped on the Muslim bandwagon and became what we call "Islam KTP" = "Islam kartu penduduk" = "Islam according to identity card". Maybe a bit like a lot of people in England, and Australia for that matter, are CofE. These non-religious people are sometimes referred to as "Abangan".Even the people who do consider themselves Muslim are very often Kejawen; the actual number of hard-core, mainline Muslims is very small, and they tend to be made the butt of humour by many other Javanese. Still, with all that said, Islam has had a deep and a lasting effect upon the way in which the keris is understood at the present time. But that's a different story. Enjoy your visit Ariel, and remind those parents of your grandchildren that visits are two way streets. We senior people are entitled to dictate terms to those who follow. Its one of the privileges of living long enough to do so. David, yes, there is some remarkably good stuff online now, have a look at Sumastuti.

2nd May 2013, 05:23 AM	#8
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Alan, I am quite familiar with the peculiarities of nonverbal communication, from showing soles of your shoes in Iran, to patting somebody else's head in Thailand, to showing the A-OK sign (middle finger and thumb forming an O) in Latin America. Believe me, I even know why in the Muslim Jawa offering something with your left hand is considered an insult :-) I do not have time for a detailed response: we are packing like crazy for a very long trip, and I am on a 5 minute break allocated by She Who Must Be Obeyed. In brief, I can see why you live in Australia, where you are just Alan, and not in some mystical Jawanese village where someone who can make a good keris is considered to be a demigod with a license to do whatever his left foot wishes:-) I may return to this discussion later on. Sorry, don't intend to be rude, but visiting grandkids is more important than stories about sharp and pointy thingies. Best wishes.