Viribus Unitis (Austro-hungarian Sword)

David · 14th September 2012, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

Hi Donny. Welcome to the forum

.
Nice sword.
Did you explore the term VIRIBUS UNITIS?

http://croatian-treasure.com/viribus.html

Would the inscription in your sword be connected to this ship?

Interesting...of course the article also states The "Viribus Unitis" was also the motto of Franz Joseph I, so it might also be related to his court in some way.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franz_Joseph_I_of_Austria

David · 14th September 2012, 05:56 PM

Actually, if you look on the flip side of this ferrule, it looks like the initials F.J. 1 are embossed there.

fernando · 14th September 2012, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Actually, if you look on the flip side of this ferrule, it looks like the initials F.J. 1 are embossed there.

So says Donny in his first post

.
Maybe officer's swords of the period had both Emperor's initials and motto

.
... or officers of the ship's garrison ?

Something not 'so hard' to confirm !

satsujinken · 17th September 2012, 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

So says Donny in his first post

.
Maybe officer's swords of the period had both Emperor's initials and motto

.
... or officers of the ship's garrison ?

Something not 'so hard' to confirm !

Hi Fernando

in the book I mentioned above, there are many swords, which is more elaborate than mine and all bearing the same emblem of double headed eagle and FJI monogram.

At first I believe that this sword is navy formal dress sword - based on the ship with the same name (VIRIBUS UNITIS) but the book said otherwise, and only stated that this is formal dress sword for higher officials, with no specific mention to navy or army.

the only problem is the Empire is no longer exist and relics are scattered worldwide, so information is very limited

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

I just wanted to note how delightful it is to see a weapon posted by someone along with details of thier own research and observations!!!!
Absolutely brilliant ! Well done Donny, thank you so much!

This prompted good return and informative exchange on the item by others. Good stuff guys.

thank you, Jim
I try my best to understand my collection and gather information for educational purposes, even though the resources here is limited - in light that this piece of history may not be forgotten and perhaps can be studied properly

and I am still wondering how on earth this piece of history from empire no longer exist stranded here in Indonesia, so far away from Austria

Jim McDougall · 17th September 2012, 03:42 PM

Donny, that is exactly to attitude and approach that I sincerely wish was more prevalent in the world of arms collecting! The weapons are the sentinels of the history they have seen, and altogether too many simply match the weapon to a picture in a book, classify it, and hang it on the wall.
Well done!

As to how it ended up in Indonesia, there are many possibilities, but without sound provenance only speculations can be offered. Naturally with the profound trade internationally which focused on the East Indies, there are many situations involving diplomatic and trade relations, and probably circumstances which would align with the period of the sword. Then of course, an item might have simply been brought back by someone who had contact with another and acquired the sword as an item of interest or curiosity.
There are countless cases of items turning up in completely incongruent circumstances vast distances away, but the global nature of trade routes, travel and networking is by far not a modern phenomenon.
Whatever the case, it is a wonderful sword, and again, thank you for sharing it here.

All the best,
Jim

Dmitry · 17th September 2012, 04:13 PM

This is an Austro-Hungarian civil servants' parade or court sword. Swords like this are frequently encountered on the market. The original scabbard had two gilt brass fittings, the top locked had a button on the front, to be worn on a shoulder sling.

satsujinken · 18th September 2012, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmitry

This is an Austro-Hungarian civil servants' parade or court sword. Swords like this are frequently encountered on the market. The original scabbard had two gilt brass fittings, the top locked had a button on the front, to be worn on a shoulder sling.

this is another enlightenment ... thank you Dmitry

is there any information on where I can purchase the scabbard ?? as mine is losing its scabbard

fernando · 14th September 2012, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

Interesting...of course the article also states The "Viribus Unitis" was also the motto of Franz Joseph I ...

Good catch David.
Obviously the ship was named after Franz Joseph's motto.

ariel · 14th September 2012, 11:35 PM

Viribus Unitis was an official motto of the Austro-Hungarian Empire: United Forces.
The same meaning as their two-headed egle.

fernando · 15th September 2012, 10:56 AM

I thought this was Franz Joseph's personal motto

Jim McDougall · 17th September 2012, 02:51 AM

I just wanted to note how delightful it is to see a weapon posted by someone along with details of thier own research and observations!!!!
Absolutely brilliant ! Well done Donny, thank you so much!

This prompted good return and informative exchange on the item by others. Good stuff guys.

14th September 2012, 05:56 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,218	Actually, if you look on the flip side of this ferrule, it looks like the initials F.J. 1 are embossed there.

17th September 2012, 03:42 PM	#5
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,281	Donny, that is exactly to attitude and approach that I sincerely wish was more prevalent in the world of arms collecting! The weapons are the sentinels of the history they have seen, and altogether too many simply match the weapon to a picture in a book, classify it, and hang it on the wall. Well done! As to how it ended up in Indonesia, there are many possibilities, but without sound provenance only speculations can be offered. Naturally with the profound trade internationally which focused on the East Indies, there are many situations involving diplomatic and trade relations, and probably circumstances which would align with the period of the sword. Then of course, an item might have simply been brought back by someone who had contact with another and acquired the sword as an item of interest or curiosity. There are countless cases of items turning up in completely incongruent circumstances vast distances away, but the global nature of trade routes, travel and networking is by far not a modern phenomenon. Whatever the case, it is a wonderful sword, and again, thank you for sharing it here. All the best, Jim

17th September 2012, 04:13 PM	#6
Dmitry Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 607	This is an Austro-Hungarian civil servants' parade or court sword. Swords like this are frequently encountered on the market. The original scabbard had two gilt brass fittings, the top locked had a button on the front, to be worn on a shoulder sling.

14th September 2012, 11:35 PM	#9
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	Viribus Unitis was an official motto of the Austro-Hungarian Empire: United Forces. The same meaning as their two-headed egle.

15th September 2012, 10:56 AM	#10
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	I thought this was Franz Joseph's personal motto

17th September 2012, 02:51 AM	#11
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,281	I just wanted to note how delightful it is to see a weapon posted by someone along with details of thier own research and observations!!!! Absolutely brilliant ! Well done Donny, thank you so much! This prompted good return and informative exchange on the item by others. Good stuff guys.