A Very Old Kris

Battara · 17th August 2012, 04:42 PM

I would say that the top one of your pictures (the one with the early golden hilt) is Sulu, although that early back we are not as sure because there are few examples from that period.

Gustav · 17th August 2012, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

I would say that the top one of your pictures (the one with the early golden hilt) is Sulu, although that early back we are not as sure because there are few examples from that period.

I ask me if there are non-Sulu krises with straight gonjo at all. If it would be true, we could suppose the straight gonjo dissapeared (or nearly dissapeared) before kris reached Mindanao (from Sulu).

One more kris with straight gonjo Gavin sold a time ago:

http://www.swordsantiqueweapons.com/s250_full.html

Spunjer's kris is really interesting becouse of its very complete early kris features, together with Gandhik area which looks Mindanao to me.

Would you agree on it?

Battara · 18th August 2012, 02:30 AM

Oh no question that Spunger's kris is an early kris (with a great blade!).

Spunjer · 18th August 2012, 12:44 PM

thx for posting additional pictures, gustav! i noticed as well that on those other examples, the asang2x mark is non-existent. looks as if it never had asang2x. the one with the gold hilt: i'm almost certain the tang on that one is circular or squarish, as oppose to the rectangular ones. again, with a narrow base like that, there's nowhere to attach the stirrup, or should i say the stirrup wasn't part of the plan..

Gustav · 18th August 2012, 01:31 PM

Dear Spunjer,

the Sulu kris with golden hilt had a stirrup for asang-asang, yet although the hilt is very early there of course still is some possibility the hilt is later then blade and blade was intended to be without asang-asang.

In Cato's book on page 72 there is a hilt with similar construction of stirrup for asang-asang, which would let us think, this kind to attach asang-asang is also old if not the oldest one.

On your kris I also see somethingwhich could be markings from front asang-asang, yet again, it could be attached later and then dissapeared again.

Spunjer · 19th August 2012, 02:29 PM

i see what you're saying gustav, regarding the stirrup. that's indeed a unique method of attaching an asang2x, something you don't see on later krises. the closest type that i could see with an almost similar type would be this one:

Maurice · 19th August 2012, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

i see what you're saying gustav, regarding the stirrup. that's indeed a unique method of attaching an asang2x, something you don't see on later krises. the closest type that i could see with an almost similar type would be this one:

Beautifull kris... Is this yours Ron?

Spunjer · 19th August 2012, 02:35 PM

not quite as fancy with the teapot handle style stirrup, but rather the asang2x was attached using a silver wire. i haven't removed the handle on this one (no need to, i guess), but am wondering if the tang is squarish or rectangular. most likely rectangular...
yeah the older archaic does have a very faint asang2x mark but like you said, it must have disappeared early in its life...

18th August 2012, 01:31 PM	#5
Gustav Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,280	Dear Spunjer, the Sulu kris with golden hilt had a stirrup for asang-asang, yet although the hilt is very early there of course still is some possibility the hilt is later then blade and blade was intended to be without asang-asang. In Cato's book on page 72 there is a hilt with similar construction of stirrup for asang-asang, which would let us think, this kind to attach asang-asang is also old if not the oldest one. On your kris I also see somethingwhich could be markings from front asang-asang, yet again, it could be attached later and then dissapeared again. Attached Images

19th August 2012, 02:29 PM	#6
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	i see what you're saying gustav, regarding the stirrup. that's indeed a unique method of attaching an asang2x, something you don't see on later krises. the closest type that i could see with an almost similar type would be this one: Attached Images

17th August 2012, 04:42 PM	#1
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	I would say that the top one of your pictures (the one with the early golden hilt) is Sulu, although that early back we are not as sure because there are few examples from that period.

18th August 2012, 02:30 AM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,280	Oh no question that Spunger's kris is an early kris (with a great blade!).

18th August 2012, 12:44 PM	#4
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	thx for posting additional pictures, gustav! i noticed as well that on those other examples, the asang2x mark is non-existent. looks as if it never had asang2x. the one with the gold hilt: i'm almost certain the tang on that one is circular or squarish, as oppose to the rectangular ones. again, with a narrow base like that, there's nowhere to attach the stirrup, or should i say the stirrup wasn't part of the plan..

19th August 2012, 02:35 PM	#8
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	not quite as fancy with the teapot handle style stirrup, but rather the asang2x was attached using a silver wire. i haven't removed the handle on this one (no need to, i guess), but am wondering if the tang is squarish or rectangular. most likely rectangular... yeah the older archaic does have a very faint asang2x mark but like you said, it must have disappeared early in its life...