New keris

nechesh · 29th August 2005, 12:17 AM

Very well put Marto. Change is the nature of ALL living things. It applies to entire cultures as well as people. The days of the empu are gone and the culture of keris is changing. Personally, i see no problem with a smith using power tools to help him create a keris at this point. It is merely the tool. What's important is how it is used. In fact, i think the smith might be a bit foolish not to explore the best possible tool for any particular job and an electric powered one might just be the ticket. Keris making is EVOLVING, for better or for worse. But i will say that some of the keris being made today are probably of the highest quality on a pure technical scale than have ever been made before.BTW, there are some very high quality keris being made these days that are never seen outside Jawa. They are being made for select group of Javanese buyers. And as was just pointed out to me just recently, many of the finest keris in museums in Europe were actually new when they were collected.

John · 29th August 2005, 03:57 AM

Can one not say ever since the "big bang"...since single celled organism appeared...changes, evolution have been in motion...the limitlessness of duality in play as the way of the universe?

The word culture has been used a lot but what would the true definition of "culture"? No doubt every sword was once new whatever influences, "form/s of the moment" they took on the moment they did.

nechesh · 29th August 2005, 06:05 AM

Hi John. I'm not so sure there is a "true" definition of ANY word, including "culture". Words are mallible things and open to the interpretation of the people using them. And definitions, like everything else, are also constantly evolving.
That being said i'm not really sure what you are trying to say here. I can't tell whether you are agreeing with me or not. My point about the finest examples of keris in European museums being collected as new was merely meant as an encouragement for people to consider the collection of new keris, since some of them are at an extremely high level of keris art and will no doubt find themselves in some museum somewhere 200 or 300 yrs. from now.

John · 29th August 2005, 06:40 AM

That's what I'm implying - culture or tradition are not something that are static but transitory.

New kerises; based on the law of supply and demand, the flow of supply no doubt will not cease as long as there are demand, appreciation of these new ones whether with encouragement or otherwise.

Boedhi Adhitya · 30th August 2005, 07:42 AM

I apologize to all forumities, since I've been away for a while and hence, not answered the questions which was addressed to me.

Mr. Purwacarita, as I discussed before with Mr. Marto Suwignyo, pusaka would mean a lot, but as I insist, it was the empu's intention, which made some blade pusakas or not. The empus used the whole process, not only the physical appearance of the blades, to show their intention, in symbolistic languages. Hence, the good pusakas should be able to show this intention. But as the blade handed down from generations, whether by inheritances or trading, the owner would treat it differently, but the empu's intention, would always be the same. And once again, this intention might be "read" by those who understand the symbolistic language used. Then, no matter how you acquire it, the pusaka is a pusaka, even if you bought it on e-bay

About history of the blades, IMHO, it should be considered as "added value". In Kraton, the history would be important, but only after the blades qualify for "pusaka qualities" as I describes before. As I've been told by the "abdi dalem pusaka", all the kraton pusaka have best iron and steel possible at the time it was made, including the Kyai Klerek, which was belongs to Prince Mangkubumi's servant/soldier. This dapur cacing kanil lance suffered a little chipping on his point while he pierced Clereq's armour. (for information, Kyai Klerek named after Major Clereq, a Dutch officer which was killed by this lance, ca. 18 C.). Other example is Kyai Mangunoneng, a sword, pedang suduk pamor tambal, which was belong to Tumenggung Mangunoneng, a considered rebellious Tumenggung. This sword was used by Prince Mangkubumi / Sultan Hamengkubuwono I to kill his own master, as a warning to any rebels. Now it is always carried by women servant on ceremonies involving the sultan in his full formal-dressing. Kanjeng Kyai Kopek, the most honoured keris in heirlooms array of Kraton Jogjakarta, in fact, was a gift from Sunan Pakubuwono III on Sultan Hamengkubuwono I coronation. It is said that KKA Kopek was belongs to Sunan Kalijaga, and hence, symbolize the unity between the Ulama (religion leader) and Umaro (the goverment/king). You may see the picture of KKA Kopek and others in "Jogja Heritage", the official book of Kraton Jogjakarta. Some errors occur on naming and pictures (reversed) thought.

Yes, it was keris Kyai Setan Kober itself who kill it's own master, while Kyai Plered only injured Arya Penangsang badly. According to the legend, Arya Penangsang was a very powerful Adipati of Jipang, who was considered rebelious to Pajang. He would only be killed by his own keris, Kyai Setan Kober, a fiery keris. In a fight against Danang Sutawijaya (which then known as Panembahan Senapati, the first king of Mataram Islam, ca 16 c), Arya Penangsang suffered a wide wound on his abdoment, causing his intestine to felt out. Disturbed by his own hanging intestine, Arya Penangsang tied it to his keris handle, and continue fighting. In the end of the fight, Sutawijaya, which was a young boy and no match to Penangsang, felt down to the ground and not able to continue the fight. Penangsang then drew the fiery Setan Kober to kill him, and incidently, Setan Kober cut Penangsang intestine which was tied to the handle. This "fatal" wound, killed Penangsang instantly. To commemorate this, according to the folklore, Panembahan Senapati then asking all the bridegroom to put jasmines-on-the strings (melati rinonce) on their keris handle to mimic the intestine and symbolizing the bravery, on wedding ceremony.

Today, the Jogjakarta court, claiming as inheritance of Mataram, sees Kanjeng Kyai Ageng Pleret as "a legitimation to govern" for the court. The lance is honoured more than the Sultan himself. Only Sultan himself who clean it on cleansing ceremony. The servants are forbidden to come close and see it on purpose while it is cleaned. Other pusakas may only cleaned after the cleaning of KKA Pleret finished. From those who has seen it incidently, KKA Pleret has exotericly pusaka qualities. The Surakarta court has Kanjeng Kyai Ageng Baru as a match.

About the Kraton's pusaka, In Jogjakarta court, there are 8 servants who specialized on maintaining and documenting the pusaka, all of these servants are court member / royal families. Detail documentation has been done since around 2000 and still on progress, but sadly, without photographs. There are nearly 150 keris kept on Gedong Pusaka/Pusaka main hall (known as Bangsal Prabayeksa), and documentation of others pusaka which is kept in another building still in progress. Lances, would be the most abundant pusaka, counting around a thousand. Once again, according to the servant which I know personally, all of the keris which is kept in Prabayeksa had a "pusaka" grade quality. History of many of them are unknown and some of them were bought by the Sultan / Court.

So, I conclude, historical values may be an important things, but it is not a main consideration. The main consideration, IMHO, would be the exoteric and isoteric qualities, which also show the ability of the empu to put his intention on the blade properly while he made the keris. What I really mean about isoteric isn't "tuah" or magical properties, but something more philosophically. How did we acquire it, might have a little values, as long as you didn't steal it

So, for me, you may buy kerises on e-bay and call it pusaka, as long as the blades qualify

Sorry, I got to go, and I would post more sharing on "Jimat ngucap pusaka kandha" and how the "isoteric" things work tomorrow

best regards.

Alam Shah · 30th August 2005, 08:58 AM

Quote:

So, for me, you may buy kerises on e-bay and call it pusaka, as long as the blades qualify

Dear Boedhi Adhitya,
How do we see/know whether the blade qualify or not as a pusaka?

Any tips/pointers that you can share with us?

nechesh · 30th August 2005, 10:35 PM

I'd like to wish you all good luck finding your next keris pusaka on eBay!

29th August 2005, 12:17 AM	#1
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Very well put Marto. Change is the nature of ALL living things. It applies to entire cultures as well as people. The days of the empu are gone and the culture of keris is changing. Personally, i see no problem with a smith using power tools to help him create a keris at this point. It is merely the tool. What's important is how it is used. In fact, i think the smith might be a bit foolish not to explore the best possible tool for any particular job and an electric powered one might just be the ticket. Keris making is EVOLVING, for better or for worse. But i will say that some of the keris being made today are probably of the highest quality on a pure technical scale than have ever been made before.BTW, there are some very high quality keris being made these days that are never seen outside Jawa. They are being made for select group of Javanese buyers. And as was just pointed out to me just recently, many of the finest keris in museums in Europe were actually new when they were collected.

29th August 2005, 03:57 AM	#2
John Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Land below the wind Posts: 135	Can one not say ever since the "big bang"...since single celled organism appeared...changes, evolution have been in motion...the limitlessness of duality in play as the way of the universe? The word culture has been used a lot but what would the true definition of "culture"? No doubt every sword was once new whatever influences, "form/s of the moment" they took on the moment they did.

29th August 2005, 06:05 AM	#3
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	Hi John. I'm not so sure there is a "true" definition of ANY word, including "culture". Words are mallible things and open to the interpretation of the people using them. And definitions, like everything else, are also constantly evolving. That being said i'm not really sure what you are trying to say here. I can't tell whether you are agreeing with me or not. My point about the finest examples of keris in European museums being collected as new was merely meant as an encouragement for people to consider the collection of new keris, since some of them are at an extremely high level of keris art and will no doubt find themselves in some museum somewhere 200 or 300 yrs. from now.

29th August 2005, 06:40 AM	#4
John Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Land below the wind Posts: 135	That's what I'm implying - culture or tradition are not something that are static but transitory. New kerises; based on the law of supply and demand, the flow of supply no doubt will not cease as long as there are demand, appreciation of these new ones whether with encouragement or otherwise.

30th August 2005, 07:42 AM	#5
Boedhi Adhitya Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 103	I apologize to all forumities, since I've been away for a while and hence, not answered the questions which was addressed to me. Mr. Purwacarita, as I discussed before with Mr. Marto Suwignyo, pusaka would mean a lot, but as I insist, it was the empu's intention, which made some blade pusakas or not. The empus used the whole process, not only the physical appearance of the blades, to show their intention, in symbolistic languages. Hence, the good pusakas should be able to show this intention. But as the blade handed down from generations, whether by inheritances or trading, the owner would treat it differently, but the empu's intention, would always be the same. And once again, this intention might be "read" by those who understand the symbolistic language used. Then, no matter how you acquire it, the pusaka is a pusaka, even if you bought it on e-bay About history of the blades, IMHO, it should be considered as "added value". In Kraton, the history would be important, but only after the blades qualify for "pusaka qualities" as I describes before. As I've been told by the "abdi dalem pusaka", all the kraton pusaka have best iron and steel possible at the time it was made, including the Kyai Klerek, which was belongs to Prince Mangkubumi's servant/soldier. This dapur cacing kanil lance suffered a little chipping on his point while he pierced Clereq's armour. (for information, Kyai Klerek named after Major Clereq, a Dutch officer which was killed by this lance, ca. 18 C.). Other example is Kyai Mangunoneng, a sword, pedang suduk pamor tambal, which was belong to Tumenggung Mangunoneng, a considered rebellious Tumenggung. This sword was used by Prince Mangkubumi / Sultan Hamengkubuwono I to kill his own master, as a warning to any rebels. Now it is always carried by women servant on ceremonies involving the sultan in his full formal-dressing. Kanjeng Kyai Kopek, the most honoured keris in heirlooms array of Kraton Jogjakarta, in fact, was a gift from Sunan Pakubuwono III on Sultan Hamengkubuwono I coronation. It is said that KKA Kopek was belongs to Sunan Kalijaga, and hence, symbolize the unity between the Ulama (religion leader) and Umaro (the goverment/king). You may see the picture of KKA Kopek and others in "Jogja Heritage", the official book of Kraton Jogjakarta. Some errors occur on naming and pictures (reversed) thought. Yes, it was keris Kyai Setan Kober itself who kill it's own master, while Kyai Plered only injured Arya Penangsang badly. According to the legend, Arya Penangsang was a very powerful Adipati of Jipang, who was considered rebelious to Pajang. He would only be killed by his own keris, Kyai Setan Kober, a fiery keris. In a fight against Danang Sutawijaya (which then known as Panembahan Senapati, the first king of Mataram Islam, ca 16 c), Arya Penangsang suffered a wide wound on his abdoment, causing his intestine to felt out. Disturbed by his own hanging intestine, Arya Penangsang tied it to his keris handle, and continue fighting. In the end of the fight, Sutawijaya, which was a young boy and no match to Penangsang, felt down to the ground and not able to continue the fight. Penangsang then drew the fiery Setan Kober to kill him, and incidently, Setan Kober cut Penangsang intestine which was tied to the handle. This "fatal" wound, killed Penangsang instantly. To commemorate this, according to the folklore, Panembahan Senapati then asking all the bridegroom to put jasmines-on-the strings (melati rinonce) on their keris handle to mimic the intestine and symbolizing the bravery, on wedding ceremony. Today, the Jogjakarta court, claiming as inheritance of Mataram, sees Kanjeng Kyai Ageng Pleret as "a legitimation to govern" for the court. The lance is honoured more than the Sultan himself. Only Sultan himself who clean it on cleansing ceremony. The servants are forbidden to come close and see it on purpose while it is cleaned. Other pusakas may only cleaned after the cleaning of KKA Pleret finished. From those who has seen it incidently, KKA Pleret has exotericly pusaka qualities. The Surakarta court has Kanjeng Kyai Ageng Baru as a match. About the Kraton's pusaka, In Jogjakarta court, there are 8 servants who specialized on maintaining and documenting the pusaka, all of these servants are court member / royal families. Detail documentation has been done since around 2000 and still on progress, but sadly, without photographs. There are nearly 150 keris kept on Gedong Pusaka/Pusaka main hall (known as Bangsal Prabayeksa), and documentation of others pusaka which is kept in another building still in progress. Lances, would be the most abundant pusaka, counting around a thousand. Once again, according to the servant which I know personally, all of the keris which is kept in Prabayeksa had a "pusaka" grade quality. History of many of them are unknown and some of them were bought by the Sultan / Court. So, I conclude, historical values may be an important things, but it is not a main consideration. The main consideration, IMHO, would be the exoteric and isoteric qualities, which also show the ability of the empu to put his intention on the blade properly while he made the keris. What I really mean about isoteric isn't "tuah" or magical properties, but something more philosophically. How did we acquire it, might have a little values, as long as you didn't steal it So, for me, you may buy kerises on e-bay and call it pusaka, as long as the blades qualify Sorry, I got to go, and I would post more sharing on "Jimat ngucap pusaka kandha" and how the "isoteric" things work tomorrow best regards.

30th August 2005, 10:35 PM	#7
nechesh Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 940	I'd like to wish you all good luck finding your next keris pusaka on eBay!