Cutlers resin...fail.

Tim Simmons · 25th March 2012, 06:33 PM

Sounds like you are using too high a heat and too quickly and burning the substances before melting into a usable substance. You sould not have any problems.
Use a gentle flame from a small spirit/meths burner or even a big spoon over a candle except a yellow flame will soot up. If you cannot find one work with embers of a fire like any native / jungleman.

katana · 25th March 2012, 09:37 PM

Perhaps using an 'un-known' resin is the problem ....impurities etc could affect the melting point. Pine pitch is often used and is nicer smelling

Curious as to why your using frankincence, an aromatic?

Best
David

A. G. Maisey · 25th March 2012, 10:15 PM

Damar selo, hard bees wax, terracotta dust.

Proportions :- 3 : 2 : 1

Must be done outside preferably with a light breeze to carry away the fumes.

The fumes can ignite.

Preparation is dangerous and I do not recommend the preparation and use of this material to anybody who has not received training from an experienced person.

When the mixture has been prepared and allowed to cool it will form a hard, rock-like deposit in the bottom of the saucepan. This can be freed from the saucepan by hitting the pan hard against the earth. You then break up the "rock" into smaller pieces and re-heat. When it is soft you pick up some from the pan with a stick, and cool it to the point where it is plastic. It will still be hot and if you do not enjoy a little bit of pain you should not have started the exercise in the first place, because you need to take the hot material between your fingers and roll it to a size that will fit the hole for the tang. You insert the rolled material, then you heat the tang and push it home while the material is still just a little bit soft. You need to work very fast from the point where you take the hot material from the pan.

You can clean up excess with mineral turps and a stiff toothbrush.

WARNING:- when this stuff is hot it will stick to your skin and burn straight through the skin into your flesh. It hurts. Believe me.

WARNING:- do the preparation outside well away from any buildings. If the fumes ignite, just leave it and run.

I do not know where to buy damar selo outside of Jawa.

The safe, sensible, easy solution for this century is to use tinted araldite.

G. McCormack · 25th March 2012, 10:58 PM

Get ye some pine sap! Then cook it to drive the volatiles off, and it changes, now you got the raw material you need for your recipe. Have fun! Do it outside, try in old (steel) tin cans. Careful, extremely flammable.

David R · 25th March 2012, 10:59 PM

Thanks everyone for all the input. I see epoxy as the easy way out....and perhaps a last resort. I will have a couple more goes at this before I give up, and will keep the forum posted with my progress. I want to go the authentic route,.... even if it is a pain in the butt.
I wonder if the teflon from the pan effected the mix. Tim, the comment about rushing it and burning the resin before it melted also struck a chord.
Ibrahim, I will try my incense supplier for the stuff you mentioned.
Katana, I used frankincese 'cause one of the forums (not here) recommended it, and I had a load of it knocking around. One of my friends is an incense wholesaler, and often buys in Egypt and Saudi, so I can get some stuff easily that is not generaly available.
Watch this space.
Hi G. just got your post, daft as it sounds, I can get the exotics more easily than the native resins...but will see what I can get in that line.

Tim Simmons · 26th March 2012, 12:51 PM

I find it useful to make a mould from cooking foil. I cast a pencil like ingot of the wax resin mix. When this is hard it is a good shape for dripping the mixture into awkward places. Also just melting the end and dabbing the mixture were you want and final shaping with your fingers when cool enough.

Atlantia · 26th March 2012, 06:00 PM

If you drive past roadworks.....

Doesn't hurt to ask, you only want a little block if you want to try a bitumen mix.

Just be careful, the burns would be horrible.

spiral · 26th March 2012, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David R

Hi G. just got your post, daft as it sounds, I can get the exotics more easily than the native resins...but will see what I can get in that line.

You should be able to get high quality solid pine resins from any music shop that sells violins{ called rosin to put on bow strings.}

Spiral

G. McCormack · 26th March 2012, 11:24 PM

David where are you located? Maybe we can brainstorm some local materials for you to try.

David R · 27th March 2012, 09:21 PM

Hi G. I am in West Yorkshire, England. Spiral, I keep forgetting about music shops, and we have a couple of decent ones local. I can also try "Pete the Pong" my incense dealer friend.
Watch this space.........

25th March 2012, 10:59 PM	#5
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,119	Thanks everyone for all the input. I see epoxy as the easy way out....and perhaps a last resort. I will have a couple more goes at this before I give up, and will keep the forum posted with my progress. I want to go the authentic route,.... even if it is a pain in the butt. I wonder if the teflon from the pan effected the mix. Tim, the comment about rushing it and burning the resin before it melted also struck a chord. Ibrahim, I will try my incense supplier for the stuff you mentioned. Katana, I used frankincese 'cause one of the forums (not here) recommended it, and I had a load of it knocking around. One of my friends is an incense wholesaler, and often buys in Egypt and Saudi, so I can get some stuff easily that is not generaly available. Watch this space. Hi G. just got your post, daft as it sounds, I can get the exotics more easily than the native resins...but will see what I can get in that line. Last edited by David R; 25th March 2012 at 11:02 PM. Reason: Saw a relavant post just after.

25th March 2012, 06:33 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,844	Sounds like you are using too high a heat and too quickly and burning the substances before melting into a usable substance. You sould not have any problems. Use a gentle flame from a small spirit/meths burner or even a big spoon over a candle except a yellow flame will soot up. If you cannot find one work with embers of a fire like any native / jungleman.

25th March 2012, 09:37 PM	#2
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,658	Perhaps using an 'un-known' resin is the problem ....impurities etc could affect the melting point. Pine pitch is often used and is nicer smelling Curious as to why your using frankincence, an aromatic? Best David

25th March 2012, 10:15 PM	#3
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,992	Damar selo, hard bees wax, terracotta dust. Proportions :- 3 : 2 : 1 Must be done outside preferably with a light breeze to carry away the fumes. The fumes can ignite. Preparation is dangerous and I do not recommend the preparation and use of this material to anybody who has not received training from an experienced person. When the mixture has been prepared and allowed to cool it will form a hard, rock-like deposit in the bottom of the saucepan. This can be freed from the saucepan by hitting the pan hard against the earth. You then break up the "rock" into smaller pieces and re-heat. When it is soft you pick up some from the pan with a stick, and cool it to the point where it is plastic. It will still be hot and if you do not enjoy a little bit of pain you should not have started the exercise in the first place, because you need to take the hot material between your fingers and roll it to a size that will fit the hole for the tang. You insert the rolled material, then you heat the tang and push it home while the material is still just a little bit soft. You need to work very fast from the point where you take the hot material from the pan. You can clean up excess with mineral turps and a stiff toothbrush. WARNING:- when this stuff is hot it will stick to your skin and burn straight through the skin into your flesh. It hurts. Believe me. WARNING:- do the preparation outside well away from any buildings. If the fumes ignite, just leave it and run. I do not know where to buy damar selo outside of Jawa. The safe, sensible, easy solution for this century is to use tinted araldite.

25th March 2012, 10:58 PM	#4
G. McCormack Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 131	Get ye some pine sap! Then cook it to drive the volatiles off, and it changes, now you got the raw material you need for your recipe. Have fun! Do it outside, try in old (steel) tin cans. Careful, extremely flammable.

26th March 2012, 12:51 PM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,844	I find it useful to make a mould from cooking foil. I cast a pencil like ingot of the wax resin mix. When this is hard it is a good shape for dripping the mixture into awkward places. Also just melting the end and dabbing the mixture were you want and final shaping with your fingers when cool enough.

26th March 2012, 06:00 PM	#7
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	If you drive past roadworks..... Doesn't hurt to ask, you only want a little block if you want to try a bitumen mix. Just be careful, the burns would be horrible.

26th March 2012, 11:24 PM	#9
G. McCormack Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tallahassee, FL Posts: 131	David where are you located? Maybe we can brainstorm some local materials for you to try.

27th March 2012, 09:21 PM	#10
David R Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,119	Hi G. I am in West Yorkshire, England. Spiral, I keep forgetting about music shops, and we have a couple of decent ones local. I can also try "Pete the Pong" my incense dealer friend. Watch this space.........