European bladed takouba

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by Wodimi

Hi Iain,

if the cross mark is no imitation, will say an original mark, than it makes no sense to me, that the blade could be earlier than 1590. Why should a German (Solingen) blacksmith made his sign on the blade, if he don't made the blade. I think the people at that time are very proud for their work and would not made their mark on an older used blade, no no. The other way had happen, in the 15./16 Cent. there are German sword makers who copy for example this ball with a cross, a Swiss mark from the 10.Cent., but very famous for their quality.

It makes more sense, if the blade is not so old, that somebody later made this mark because this quality European blades had for sure a bigger value and the believe of the people maybe also more power with such (magic) signs. This you can read in documents from Henry Lhote and also Jean Gabus told so. That's the reason why I asked for your feeling, original or later attached mark.

The question Hausa or Tuareg......have you copper parts at your new beautiful sword? If not, it would be for me one point for Hausa origin, because Tuareg normal use all three materials, iron, brass and copper.

only some thoughts.

Merry Christmas to all
Wolf

While not relevant to the marking on this sword directly (though the cross enclosed withing a circle may be perceived as a variant I suppose)...I am intrigued by the observation that the cross and orb is a Swiss mark from the 10th century. The marking indeed was used by German makers, but I am wondering what Swiss makers this refers to.

I have been searching through references and finally found a comment in Briggs (1965) citing Henri Lhote, who in 1954 wrote "...the cross and orb originated as a Swiss mark applied to blades made in Vienne in France, which was widely copied by German armourers in 15th and 16th c. In point of fact it seems to have been essentially a German mark".
In another reference to work by Lhote, Briggs is curious as to how he arrived at the conclusion that copper and brass inlaid markings are proof that these had to have been added in Africa, as there was no tradition in Europe for this practice with these metals? There was, the term in Europe was 'latten' and the practice dates into the early centuries of blade production.

I am truly curious on 10th century use of the marks by the Swiss and if for the sake of accuracy we might know what references state this. I have been under the impression, much as Briggs apparantly, that these cross and orb marks were used by Solingen makers primarily.