Colonial-era spike axe/tomahawk

Gt Obach · 9th August 2005, 04:57 PM

oddly.... I can't help but think that the rivet repair was actually intensional...

my thoughts are that this is the way the axe was made..
- if the axe was made of wrought iron..... which is fiberous... the fibers will split generally in the direction they are heading.....
- in other words.. the split should be perpendicular to that one on the axe..

well.. this is just my idea.......

Greg

M ELEY · 10th August 2005, 09:30 PM

Justin-
My point exactly concerning fakes- see my post under Chinese fakes. They are getting to be very numerous. I find these particularly insulting, because they are such treasured Native American artifacts and considering what we did to them as a people, this is a double wamie...

Rick-
Excellent point as well. I forgot to mention that angle. I hadn't thought about the sheer scarcity of man-made nails back in those times. I'm told true nail production throughout the western world began around 1801, so this fits.

Greg-
Interesting point, and I don't know enough about smithing to land an oppinion. Would riviting like this have been around pre-1840 or so, I wonder? How would the rivit/plug be put in place?

Gt Obach · 11th August 2005, 02:56 AM

Hi
it's is also possible that the rivet is a repair..... just that I have a suspicious feeling that is was made like this..

- yes... riveting would be a very well known practice back then..

- to rivet.... you basically use a punch or a drift to make the hole...... find the appropriate size round stock to fit the hole........ then pein the ends of the rivet to flare out the round stock at either end...... looks like a mushroom..... then you grind the rivet flush with the axe profile.... then use a axe drift to reshape the axe handle socket..

- ofcourse i've never made an axe like this..... but this is a possible scenario..
- my axes are usually welded up or drifted

- perhaps this was a case were the smith had no flux to weld......or maybe the smith was not experienced with welding and felt a rivet would work as well..

personally, i've seen rivets being used in areas that take a beating and hold up real well..... so it is a method of securing steel

just my opinion
Greg

M ELEY · 11th August 2005, 05:59 AM

Thanks for the information,Greg. I just saw a naval dirk from ca.1805 with rivits through the hilt to secure it, so I see that you are right that this is a possibility. Thanks!

Andrew · 11th August 2005, 06:26 AM

I don't want to get into valuations, but allow me to comment that I've seen similar 'hawks sell for obscene amounts of money.

If this is the real deal, Mark, you may have won the lottery!

M ELEY · 11th August 2005, 05:54 PM

www.tomahawks.info/id58.htm

Thanks, Andrew. It's always nice to be reminded when we collectors get the occasional bargain. I love the axe. Here's a site I stumbled upon by accident with some of those prices (eBay prices, so some of these would probably sell for more in edged weapon catalogs). The guys on this site seem to have as much affection for their collecting area as we do, colplete with knowledge. I've definately been bit by the 'axe' bug now! Probably try and pick up a few more of these over time.

9th August 2005, 04:57 PM	#1
Gt Obach Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 116	oddly.... I can't help but think that the rivet repair was actually intensional... my thoughts are that this is the way the axe was made.. - if the axe was made of wrought iron..... which is fiberous... the fibers will split generally in the direction they are heading..... - in other words.. the split should be perpendicular to that one on the axe.. well.. this is just my idea....... Greg

10th August 2005, 09:30 PM	#2
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	Justin- My point exactly concerning fakes- see my post under Chinese fakes. They are getting to be very numerous. I find these particularly insulting, because they are such treasured Native American artifacts and considering what we did to them as a people, this is a double wamie... Rick- Excellent point as well. I forgot to mention that angle. I hadn't thought about the sheer scarcity of man-made nails back in those times. I'm told true nail production throughout the western world began around 1801, so this fits. Greg- Interesting point, and I don't know enough about smithing to land an oppinion. Would riviting like this have been around pre-1840 or so, I wonder? How would the rivit/plug be put in place?

11th August 2005, 02:56 AM	#3
Gt Obach Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 116	Hi it's is also possible that the rivet is a repair..... just that I have a suspicious feeling that is was made like this.. - yes... riveting would be a very well known practice back then.. - to rivet.... you basically use a punch or a drift to make the hole...... find the appropriate size round stock to fit the hole........ then pein the ends of the rivet to flare out the round stock at either end...... looks like a mushroom..... then you grind the rivet flush with the axe profile.... then use a axe drift to reshape the axe handle socket.. - ofcourse i've never made an axe like this..... but this is a possible scenario.. - my axes are usually welded up or drifted - perhaps this was a case were the smith had no flux to weld......or maybe the smith was not experienced with welding and felt a rivet would work as well.. personally, i've seen rivets being used in areas that take a beating and hold up real well..... so it is a method of securing steel just my opinion Greg

11th August 2005, 05:59 AM	#4
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	Thanks for the information,Greg. I just saw a naval dirk from ca.1805 with rivits through the hilt to secure it, so I see that you are right that this is a possibility. Thanks!

11th August 2005, 06:26 AM	#5
Andrew Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,725	I don't want to get into valuations, but allow me to comment that I've seen similar 'hawks sell for obscene amounts of money. If this is the real deal, Mark, you may have won the lottery!

11th August 2005, 05:54 PM	#6
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	www.tomahawks.info/id58.htm Thanks, Andrew. It's always nice to be reminded when we collectors get the occasional bargain. I love the axe. Here's a site I stumbled upon by accident with some of those prices (eBay prices, so some of these would probably sell for more in edged weapon catalogs). The guys on this site seem to have as much affection for their collecting area as we do, colplete with knowledge. I've definately been bit by the 'axe' bug now! Probably try and pick up a few more of these over time.