North Afrika Sword ?

Iain · 21st September 2011, 08:00 PM

Oman and it's old. Ibrahiim I'm sure will be able to explain a lot better.

Is that a design etched on the blade? A closeup of that and the hilt would be helpful, also the patterns on the scabbard.

Gavin Nugent · 22nd September 2011, 02:52 AM

Congrats on a very nice find. There are some very good discussions about these if you spend some time trawling through the acrhives with the search function.
Good detailed photos may tell more of a story about this one though as Iain had indicated.

kahnjar1 · 22nd September 2011, 06:11 AM

ENVY ENVY

Yes Oman and as has already been stated quite old.

Martin Lubojacky · 22nd September 2011, 09:02 AM

Congratulations - if this sword is yours. This should really be old type/shape and it looks it is "in good health"

CharlesS · 22nd September 2011, 02:16 PM

Nice piece, and complete!

Would it be correct, technically, to call this an early kattara?

Iain · 4th October 2011, 02:30 PM

A pity this thread didn't receive more attention.

Where you ever able to make more photographs Chregu?

Jim McDougall · 4th October 2011, 07:18 PM

Hi Chregu,
I must apologize for lack of attention to your posting of this type sword, which a number of years ago would have brought a hornets nest of activity. I have anxiously been hoping that Ibrahiim, our resident authority on these swords from Oman, would respond. He has completed a great deal of considerably thorough research, coupled with the fact that he is situated in Oman.
I will add what I can recall from our discussions and try to describe more on this extremely desirable sword from Oman that you have posted.

In Robert Elgood's "Arms and Armour of Arabia" (p.17, fig. 2.13 and 2.15) he illustrates and describes these curious and ancient looking swords from Oman with the suggestion that they may be a proto-kattara (these being the long blade broadswords with cylindrical hilt).

Apparantly as revealed in fascinating discussions with Ibrahiim held here last May, these downward quilloned swords are from the interior of Oman, situated around the capital of Nizwa, and are of a form extant for many centuries. These seem to have evolved from earlier Abbasid battle swords from about 8-9th centuries, and remained in use by the tribes in the interior who are primarily followers of the Ibadi sect of Islam. It appears that the coastal regions of Oman, known as Muscat, is where the other form of kattara developed with the maritime trade and mercants there.

With constant conflict between the Ibadi tribes of the interior and the quite separate religiously and culturally Muscat coastal regions, the schism resulted in virtually two disconnected parts to Oman. With this, these traditional form swords stood in use concurrently with the more famliar cylindrical hilted kattara typically carried by the merchants of Muscat and becoming well known from coastal trade ports into Africa and Omans Zanzibar Sultanate.

Examples of this type also seen in "Arms and Armour of the Muslim Knight" (p.79, #43) where the form is generally regarded as 17th-18th century, but certainly remained in use much later, probably even into 20th century. Again, these would be considered an Omani sa'if in the sense that it is from Oman, but separate in form from the distinctive and familiar cylindrical hilted 'kattara' well known throughout Arabian trade routes.

I hope this helps, and hopefully Ibrahiim will come in and better detail my admittedly rough explanation.

All best regards,
Jim

21st September 2011, 08:00 PM	#1
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,717	Oman and it's old. Ibrahiim I'm sure will be able to explain a lot better. Is that a design etched on the blade? A closeup of that and the hilt would be helpful, also the patterns on the scabbard.

22nd September 2011, 02:52 AM	#2
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	Congrats on a very nice find. There are some very good discussions about these if you spend some time trawling through the acrhives with the search function. Good detailed photos may tell more of a story about this one though as Iain had indicated.

22nd September 2011, 06:11 AM	#3
kahnjar1 Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: CHRISTCHURCH NEW ZEALAND Posts: 2,789	ENVY ENVY Yes Oman and as has already been stated quite old.

22nd September 2011, 09:02 AM	#4
Martin Lubojacky Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 843	Congratulations - if this sword is yours. This should really be old type/shape and it looks it is "in good health"

22nd September 2011, 02:16 PM	#5
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,854	Nice piece, and complete! Would it be correct, technically, to call this an early kattara?

4th October 2011, 02:30 PM	#6
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,717	A pity this thread didn't receive more attention. Where you ever able to make more photographs Chregu?

4th October 2011, 07:18 PM	#7
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,281	Hi Chregu, I must apologize for lack of attention to your posting of this type sword, which a number of years ago would have brought a hornets nest of activity. I have anxiously been hoping that Ibrahiim, our resident authority on these swords from Oman, would respond. He has completed a great deal of considerably thorough research, coupled with the fact that he is situated in Oman. I will add what I can recall from our discussions and try to describe more on this extremely desirable sword from Oman that you have posted. In Robert Elgood's "Arms and Armour of Arabia" (p.17, fig. 2.13 and 2.15) he illustrates and describes these curious and ancient looking swords from Oman with the suggestion that they may be a proto-kattara (these being the long blade broadswords with cylindrical hilt). Apparantly as revealed in fascinating discussions with Ibrahiim held here last May, these downward quilloned swords are from the interior of Oman, situated around the capital of Nizwa, and are of a form extant for many centuries. These seem to have evolved from earlier Abbasid battle swords from about 8-9th centuries, and remained in use by the tribes in the interior who are primarily followers of the Ibadi sect of Islam. It appears that the coastal regions of Oman, known as Muscat, is where the other form of kattara developed with the maritime trade and mercants there. With constant conflict between the Ibadi tribes of the interior and the quite separate religiously and culturally Muscat coastal regions, the schism resulted in virtually two disconnected parts to Oman. With this, these traditional form swords stood in use concurrently with the more famliar cylindrical hilted kattara typically carried by the merchants of Muscat and becoming well known from coastal trade ports into Africa and Omans Zanzibar Sultanate. Examples of this type also seen in "Arms and Armour of the Muslim Knight" (p.79, #43) where the form is generally regarded as 17th-18th century, but certainly remained in use much later, probably even into 20th century. Again, these would be considered an Omani sa'if in the sense that it is from Oman, but separate in form from the distinctive and familiar cylindrical hilted 'kattara' well known throughout Arabian trade routes. I hope this helps, and hopefully Ibrahiim will come in and better detail my admittedly rough explanation. All best regards, Jim