Mandau with some unusual motifs

[VVV]

Thanks,

I haven't thought about this resemblance before.
Do you think it's the same with the moro symbols, where it's much more often found?

Michael

[David]

Originally Posted by VVV

Thanks,

I haven't thought about this resemblance before.
Do you think it's the same with the moro symbols, where it's much more often found?

Michael

I would be careful assigning the same symbolism here (not that we really know anything more about the meaning of these circles on Moro weapons either). The circle is such a primal and archetypical form that we are bound to see it's use in just about any culture with no really connection to it's use in another. It should also be noted that the circles on this Dayak sheath interlock in a specific and different way than the Moro rings do. I feel fairly certain that the number of rings must hold some significance. Do all these have six rings when seen on Moro weapons? The rings on the Dayak sheath appear to wrap around and continue on the other side. How many rings are present there?

[VVV]

Yes Maurice, I remember that mandau. I have also had a mandau with chinese plates like yours
(but not as nice). Chinese beads and urns are very popular too among dayaks, all over the island.

David, the rings don't continue on the other side/half of the scabbard.
As a rule the back side is always unadorned on mandau scabbards.
On the Moro rings I have another kris with rings like that and it has 8 of them.
The reason I was curious on it was because the dayaks of Sarawak/Sabah
had a lot of contacts with Moros so that's maybe why it could have had the same source.

Michael

[asomotif]

Hello Michael,

I have never seen interlocking rings like these on a scabbard either.
Circles can also depict a snakes biting its own tail. or 2 snakes biting each others tail. The snake being a form of naga/aso like creature.

Best regards,
Willem

[David]

Originally Posted by asomotif

Circles can also depict a snakes biting its own tail. or 2 snakes biting each others tail. The snake being a form of naga/aso like creature.

The ouroboros (snake biting it's own tail) is a symbol that can be found in ancient Greece and Egypt and a concept that has been described (though i have never seen it depicted) in ancient India. It was picked up and used to a great extent as a European alchemical symbol. I do not believe i have ever seen it used in any Asian or SEA symbolism.
MIchael, i still think that the number of rings would be significant to the meaning of the symbol, so it is possible that the 6-ringed symbol on your one kris has a different talismanic purpose than your 8-ringed example.
There may well be a connection between the circles used on these Moro weapons and the ones on this sheath, but we can only speculate, especially with a symbol such as a circle which is so pervasive throughout all cultures.

[Maurice]

Michael,

I once had one with circles at the front of the scabbardmouth, I suddenly remembered.

The circles are not that beautifull carved as yours, but they are plain circles next to eachother......

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=7978


Maurice

[VVV]

Thanks all for your additional comments.
I haven't either seen the snake biting it's own tail in Borneo or Malay symbolism.
On the amount of circles I first suspected that the circle motif was a more potent (= complex or hidden if you follow the principles of seals and magic theories) variation of the seal of Solomon as seen above the rings in my example. My other Moro kris has 8 rings which corresponds to the 8 rings in the seal. The problem is that my "new" kris (the one on the picture enclosed above) only has 6.
Maurice, with your ex-mandau we now have 2 of those. based on the 100's of mandau we have in our networks collections as well as the museum databases that still is quite rare. BUT a collector friend of mine (A) told me that maybe it comes from other utensils like the enclosed example from Hose & McDougall Vol 1, p. 229? Unfortunately there is no explanation to it and in the other books of Borneo motifs, like A.R. Hein, I don't find it.

Michael