![]() |
|
![]() |
#1 |
Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,193
|
![]()
Excellent suggestion Iain! and I am surprised that after all our discussions on these areas that I completely forgot about Chad! It seems clear that areas of more extensive French presence colonially would more likely provide provenance for such a blade on a kaskara. These areas, in fact most of Africa, was a virtual hotbed of geopolitical colonial flux in the latter part of the 19th century.
It would seem that a poetic French verse, possibly from this esteemed French poet may likely have served metaphorically as an inscription on this French blade as well suggested by Yuanzhumin (superb job on that ttanslation BTW! ![]() All the very best, Jim |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#2 |
Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 227
|
![]()
...more and more interesting
![]() So Rimbaud was there during the Mahdiya? |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#3 |
Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,193
|
![]()
As briefly as I can put it, he was in Harar, Abyssinia 1884-1891 as a merchant dealing in coffee and weapons.
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#4 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ex-Taipei, Taiwan, now in Shanghai, China
Posts: 180
|
![]()
The text on the blade is very easy to read, at least for a native French speaker, and is in good French. The text seems to have been copied on the blade by someone that knew perfectly its meaning in French, because he added the drawing/representation of a long haired woman – the idealized woman the man that copied the text on the sword is dreaming about. Obviously, this is a local sword, but the owner or at least the guy that wrote/copied the poem on it must have been a French and mostly a French expatriate, and a cultivated and romantic one. Not the average adventurer nor the regular colonial soldier that we could find in these areas.
To put things in a different perspective: -Don’t forget that the country called Sudan today was formerly an English colony but that it is only a fraction - the eastern fraction - of what was called Sudan in colonial time. In fact, you can see hereafter that the Sudan area was also made of a Western part, that was French, which have evolved in few modern countries with post-colonial names (Mali, Niger, Chad…). -Concerning Arthur Rimbaud that spent 10 years in the Africa horn, here after an extract from this website (http://www.kirjasto.sci.fi/rimbaud.htm): Rimbaud arrived in 1880 in Aden after short sojourns in Java and Cyprus. Rimbaud made business travels in modern-day Yemen, Ethiopia, and Egypt, and walked occasionally hundreds of miles at the head of trading caravans through dangerous lands. He was the first European to penetrate into the country of Ogadain. His expertise and learning of the language, religion, and culture of local peoples was acknowledged when the French Geographical Society deemed his commercial and geographical report on East Africa worthy of publication. More infos on Rimbaud: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Rimbaud About the French Sudan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Sudan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Sudan More about the French Somaliland where stayed Rimbaud: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Somaliland Best Nicolas |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#5 | |
Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Paris (FR*) Cairo (EG)
Posts: 1,142
|
![]() Quote:
it's should not be simple ... because .. before 1890, these territories were African Empires, then - 1890: The Lake Chad has been divided into three areas - British, German and French. - 1900: Rabah (slave trader, having an army) and Lamy (French Officer, having an army) are both killed during the Battle of Kousseri, which marks the beginning of the conquest of territory by the French army and the end of independence in this part of the African Sahel. The population of Ouaddai resists until 1909 while the North (Borkou Ennedi and Tibesti) remains under French military administration until 1965. So, blades trade did not result from the French colonization it was a previous business practice By 1905, most of the area was under firm French control as a part of French Sudan. In early 1959, French Sudan (which changed its name to the Sudanese Republic) and Senegal united to become the Mali Federation. (extracted from "Wikipedia" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mali) very ... very complicated situation, who is a big part responsable for the present troubles ... ![]() à + Dom |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#6 |
Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,193
|
![]()
Thank you so much Nicolas and Dom, for the clarification and patiently itemized notations on these indeed very complex situations. I really appreciate it when things are so well explained, and it really adds great perspective. It would seem that, rather than unusual to see a French blade on these swords, it is surprising not to see more!
![]() All best regards, Jim |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#7 |
Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Olomouc
Posts: 1,708
|
![]()
My point in mentioning Chad wasn't that the blade should be French - it's clearly German with the inscription added later by a Frenchman as Nicolas pointed it it must have been, but rather my point was I excepted we should look in areas that had French colonial presence to explain the inscription. Not to explain the blade as these German trade blades could be found all over the place and as Dom says didn't result from the colonization and are in fact not uncommon. Sadly I don't think the sword has any regional characteristics that can pin down a geographical location more closely.
That said, I didn't know about the potential link with Rimbaud before and it is a very interesting idea, but just to play devil's advocate, and because I really don't know... Wouldn't a decent percentage of the French officer corp. engaged in the French Sudan have the education to use similar verse? I do think the Rimbaud idea though is quite valid just wondering if the poetry itself is of a nature to rule out other the many other educated Frenchmen in the area... I specifically mentioned Chad over the rest of the French Sudan because this territory would hold the most kaskara using peoples as opposed to modern day Mali or Niger where the takouba was common. Great discussion guys, looking forward to what else may come to light. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#8 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ex-Taipei, Taiwan, now in Shanghai, China
Posts: 180
|
![]()
iain,
I think that all the officers in the French army at that time would have the cultural level to write this text on a sword. But not as many would have had the poetic mind to do it ! :-) In France before the Revolution, aristocratic families were sending at least one of their sons into the army. After, it was difficult to avoid not being incorporated during the first Empire wars, when nearly half of the French male population died or was wounded fighting for Napoleon. During the 19th cent, these military traditions went on, mostly at the time the French were building a colonial Empire. Fighting for France was largely seen as an honor, and many French intellectuals, authors, poets fought during the many wars we were involved in around the world or in Europe. Rimbaud's father was a career officer in the French colonial army, Rimbaud himself joined the Dutch army in Indonesia for a short time. Then he lead an adventurous life in Africa, where I'm sure he had to be put in circumstances where he had to fight for his life. It's certainly not the discipline of the army that attracted the more educated Frenchmen in the army but the adventure, a certain romantism and idealism, or simply the will to defend France when the country was endangered. Here is a list of the french writers that died for France during the two last world wars only: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_d...pour_la_France Best Nicolas |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#9 |
Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Olomouc
Posts: 1,708
|
![]()
Hi Nicolas,
That's what I figured more or less. If only there was a little more to the verses on the sword to tie it to Rimbaud! Might be interesting to see if there's any academics who specialize in his works who might be able to give an opinion if the style fits with Rimbaud? I read that at least some of his letters survive from the period he was in Africa. Otherwise I have to say, the subject matter seems the sort of thing that would be on most solider's minds! Of course how it is expressed is far more eloquent than the average solider would come up with I'm sure. Cheers, Iain |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#10 |
Arms Historian
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Route 66
Posts: 10,193
|
![]()
This really is a great discussion, and it really helps to have interactive observations to gain key perspective in evaluating a piece. Stephen, I must say I have been remiss in not acknowledging your input here, which has also been most helpful. I am always grateful for your posting these fascinating examples, and admire your willingness to place them here for us to learn from, and hope our observations are helpful in increasing your knowledge.
As Iain has noted, the fact that this is a German made blade, produced by a well known exporter of these times from Solingen, does correspond with the large number of blades found on kaskara throughout the Sudan. Also, as noted, the addition of this poetic verse in inscription was clearly done by a Frenchman and intended for a French sword. This of course suggests that the weapon was apparantly used by a Frenchman, and either the blade was mounted in Europe before arrival in French regions in Africa (as was sometimes done by Clauberg and other Solingen makers) or it was done by an outfitter in Africa furbishing swords intended for French use. There is no reason why such specifically French verse would be placed on a trade blade intended for other parties, and most certainly not on a blade intended for a Sudanese tribesman. I am not familiar from Rimbaud, nor in fact had I ever heard of him until this thread, however, it does seem his writing was well known, especially probably among military men as he was military himself. Factor that into the established fact that he dealt in weapons in Abyssinia and probably throughout the region, and it does not seem unreasonable that his verse might appear on a French blade used by a Frenchman in these regions. While it does seem paradoxical that wistful romantic notions would be in the minds of soldiers on campaign, or for that matter, any men far from home and loved ones in places where they are strangers....it is entirely a matter of fact and well known. Todays generations are more familiar with media driven views of machismo, bravado and coarse violence in action movies etc. though anyone who is a true student of martial arts or actually soldiers in service know that discipline, understanding and many more compassionate and humanistic qualities are at the base of thier actions. That too is paradoxical of course, but well known. Most men who have been soldiers hold deeply these powerful emotions, and are reluctant to reveal them openly, but in those times, and obviously with the French, it is not at all surprising to see popularly known verse of this kind. As noted by Iain, it is not the kind of thing that would be placed on a blade in the field by a French soldier, but very much the kind of thing that when seen by a soldier, would be heartily accepted and used. All best regards, Jim |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
|
|