STRANGE MOUKALA RIFLE

[Dom]

Originally Posted by mjamerks

Would like to hear some thoughts about this rifle.
It looks like a moukhala but has a miquelet lock.
Also the woodcarving and decorations look european.
Can this be a hunting rifle made in Nort africa,in a european style??
I have never seen one before.
Also the barrel is signed,translation would be welcome.

Let me know your thoughts!!

"moukhala" and not "mokhala" the last one is, a pot containing the "khol"

the "moukhala" it's not really an hunting gun
more used for festivities; fantasia is rooted in Moroccan tradition,
the fantasia is a combination of charging on horseback and "moukhala" shooting,
though it is highly spectacular, it's typically Moroccan war game

The MOKHALA (or KAHALE) is a bottle (chased silver) used to contain the KHOL
(KHOL black powder prepared from lead sulphide) which is the powder to blacken the eyes of women in Oriental countries.

your rifle has a beautiful miquelet lock, and got a strong Europeen, or even French influence for the wood carving decoration
I noticed also the very nice ramrod, in suit with the canon decor
this rifle should be from begining of 19th century

congratulations

à +

Dom

[Dom]

translation ... but ...
just for the sound, not for meaning ...
we dunno what that mean

à +

Dom

[mjamerks]

Originally Posted by Dom

translation ... but ...
just for the sound, not for meaning ...
we dunno what that mean

à +

Dom

Thanks Dom

At first I thought it was a composite piece,adjusted by a a handy european.
But the more I look at the details makes it a very nice complete rifle.
A bit ruff in quality,but very attractive.

The word SINEER or sound is strange,why would someone engrave this
on a barrel???

Martin

[Dom]

Originally Posted by mjamerks

Thanks Dom

At first I thought it was a composite piece,adjusted by a a handy european.
But the more I look at the details makes it a very nice complete rifle.
A bit ruff in quality,but very attractive.

The word SINEER or sound is strange,why would someone engrave this
on a barrel???

Martin

Hi Martin
- rough quality ?? again, have a look on ramrod, to care to have the same design than the barrel, I don't call that "standard"
- nothing strange to have an European influence, Frenchmen are on spot over there since beginning of 20th century
- "sineer" may be also, a transfer from Berber language, few people in Morocco are Arabic speakers

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Dom

[mjamerks]

Originally Posted by Dom

Hi Martin
- rough quality ?? again, have a look on ramrod, to care to have the same design than the barrel, I don't call that "standard"
- nothing strange to have an European influence, Frenchmen are on spot over there since beginning of 20th century
- "sineer" may be also, a transfer from Berber language, few people in Morocco are Arabic speakers

à +

Dom

Hi Dom

yes its not standard to have the same design on the ramrod.
But I have better quality examples from these kind of rifles.
In all a nice adittion to the collection.

Thanks

Martin

[ward]

Respectfully morrocanns are not arabic speakers is a pretty questionable statement. Do they mix arabic with french,various berber dialects and some german and english mix yes. they tend to use a more simplified version of all of these languages. It is like saying egyptians do not speak arabic because they do not use kaa corectly. coffee = kawa = egyptian arabic awa.
Reginal differences abound with all languages

[ward]

No inletting of the lock is very odd. Also is the scroll work on the stock is it carved or is it a jesso application. mix of styles I would look more toward tunisa. I think date is later 1920-1930s espessially if it is jesso

[Dom]

Originally Posted by ward

Respectfully morrocanns are not arabic speakers is a pretty questionable statement. Do they mix arabic with french,various berber dialects and some german and english mix yes. they tend to use a more simplified version of all of these languages. It is like saying egyptians do not speak arabic because they do not use kaa corectly. coffee = kawa = egyptian arabic awa.
Reginal differences abound with all languages

ward ... does you try to trap me
I have some background about who is speaking more or less Arabic, just because I was residing several years in those country
yourself ward you have a clear idea about that matter, isn't
for the new-by ...
- classic Arabic, is the pure Arab language, used for religion (Quran wrote in this language), but also, all newspapers, courses in University, news in TV, in ALL Arabic Islamic country

- KSA is the country where the colloquial language is the nearest from classic form

- Egypt, has some few difference, with typical idioms, but yet near to classic

- Libya, it's in between of KSA and Egypt

- Algeria, ... the mess ... 3 words in French with "at" at end, then 2 words in Arabic, 1 word in Berber
all Berbers (5 ethnics) are not speaking Arabic AT ALL, and they refuse to learn it ...
black population from Adrar (Timimoun) are speaking a very good and clear Arabic

- Morocco, they speaks Berber for a large majority, few are using Arabic language, otherwise, they use mainly French language

all that is a bit schematic, not easy to summarize, but I must be, more or less, not too far from ... my truth

I'm "respectfully for Moroccans",
my own grand-daughter has 1/4 blood from them
but facts are there ...

best Regards ward

à +

Dom