FINE SWORD, INDONESIA OR MALAYSIAN ?

Ron Anderson · 1st October 2010, 05:36 AM

Looking at the shading, and the grain, it's almost certain this is buffalo horn.

They apparently boil it before working it.

When I get the chance, I'll try post pictures of the horn hilts I have. I have about 20 Lombok hilts, all figural and quite exquisitely carved.

Ron Anderson · 1st October 2010, 05:50 AM

However, I agree with Gav that the chiseling on the forte is also worth noting.

It really is nice work all round.

Maurice · 1st October 2010, 05:04 PM

Looking at the shape of the blade, I still would vote for Sumatran.. ;-)
Also I have seen several Sumatran pedangs with horn hilts in the shape as this one, only plain without that beautifull floral design carved in it.
I am still thinking that the handle is horn, as far as I can see on the image, but I can be mistaken ofcourse.
Horn by the way is used on all the islands of the indonesian archipellago. I am not sure if it is correct to say that when it is horn, it probably is Lombok.

In Sumatra also a lot of handles are made of carabao horn...

A friend of mine has 6 of these pedangs in his collection. All with gold and suassa and complete with scabbards.

Two of them have upward curved blades, and the scabbards of those two are both plain wood.

Three of them have a similar scabbard as the one Vandoo posted. One scabbard with no decoration at all, one with a suassa scabbardtip and suassa scabbardmouth, and one with a silver scabbardtip and silver scabbardmouth, and one silver band in between.
But none of the 6 have very highly decorated scabbards with gold as you would think it should have....

Battara · 1st October 2010, 07:48 PM

Maurice would your friend allow you to post these pieces and/or their scabbards?

In the meantime, Maurice the pieces with swassa, were the scabbard top and bottoms repoussed to match the hilt work or were they plain?

Maurice · 1st October 2010, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

Maurice would your friend allow you to post these pieces and/or their scabbards?

In the meantime, Maurice the pieces with swassa, were the scabbard top and bottoms repoussed to match the hilt work or were they plain?

Sorry, can't post the images that aren't mine..

The suassa scabbardpieces on top and bottom are plain, just as the suassa parts on the hilt. The golden sleeve in the middle has nice repoussed floral decorations...

Maurice · 1st October 2010, 08:32 PM

The pedang with golden repoussed sleeve and plain suassa ferrule, and the scabbard with silver bands, must be original.

At first sight it looks a bit strange, the silver on the scabbard in combination with the gold and suassa on the handle, but the repousse floral motifs on the golden sleeve and other decorations are the same as on the silverwork of the scabbard....

David · 1st October 2010, 08:55 PM

I don't know if this will help any, but i enlarged the section in question and lightened up the surface area some. I can't really blow this up much larger or it starts to pixelate to much.
It still looks like it could go either way, but i lean towards horn here. However i agree with Maurice that horn is a popular higher end material all over Indonesian and i don't think we can place the point of origin based on this choice alone.

Battara · 2nd October 2010, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maurice

The pedang with golden repoussed sleeve and plain suassa ferrule, and the scabbard with silver bands, must be original.

At first sight it looks a bit strange, the silver on the scabbard in combination with the gold and suassa on the handle, but the repousse floral motifs on the golden sleeve and other decorations are the same as on the silverwork of the scabbard....

You are right. This does sound strange at least to my non-Indonesian ears. So I guess that the above scabbard could be original after all. Interesting..........

I also assume that these pieces are rare?

1st October 2010, 07:48 PM	#4
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,310	Maurice would your friend allow you to post these pieces and/or their scabbards? In the meantime, Maurice the pieces with swassa, were the scabbard top and bottoms repoussed to match the hilt work or were they plain? Last edited by Battara; 1st October 2010 at 07:59 PM.

1st October 2010, 08:55 PM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,229	I don't know if this will help any, but i enlarged the section in question and lightened up the surface area some. I can't really blow this up much larger or it starts to pixelate to much. It still looks like it could go either way, but i lean towards horn here. However i agree with Maurice that horn is a popular higher end material all over Indonesian and i don't think we can place the point of origin based on this choice alone. Attached Images

1st October 2010, 05:36 AM	#1
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	Looking at the shading, and the grain, it's almost certain this is buffalo horn. They apparently boil it before working it. When I get the chance, I'll try post pictures of the horn hilts I have. I have about 20 Lombok hilts, all figural and quite exquisitely carved.

1st October 2010, 05:50 AM	#2
Ron Anderson Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 228	However, I agree with Gav that the chiseling on the forte is also worth noting. It really is nice work all round.

1st October 2010, 05:04 PM	#3
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,456	Looking at the shape of the blade, I still would vote for Sumatran.. ;-) Also I have seen several Sumatran pedangs with horn hilts in the shape as this one, only plain without that beautifull floral design carved in it. I am still thinking that the handle is horn, as far as I can see on the image, but I can be mistaken ofcourse. Horn by the way is used on all the islands of the indonesian archipellago. I am not sure if it is correct to say that when it is horn, it probably is Lombok. In Sumatra also a lot of handles are made of carabao horn... A friend of mine has 6 of these pedangs in his collection. All with gold and suassa and complete with scabbards. Two of them have upward curved blades, and the scabbards of those two are both plain wood. Three of them have a similar scabbard as the one Vandoo posted. One scabbard with no decoration at all, one with a suassa scabbardtip and suassa scabbardmouth, and one with a silver scabbardtip and silver scabbardmouth, and one silver band in between. But none of the 6 have very highly decorated scabbards with gold as you would think it should have....

1st October 2010, 08:32 PM	#6
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,456	The pedang with golden repoussed sleeve and plain suassa ferrule, and the scabbard with silver bands, must be original. At first sight it looks a bit strange, the silver on the scabbard in combination with the gold and suassa on the handle, but the repousse floral motifs on the golden sleeve and other decorations are the same as on the silverwork of the scabbard....