Corsican Vendetta Daggers

[kronckew]

well, i've got a vendetta folder similar to that one, mine has horn grips,



i was thinking more along the lines of the fixed blade versions like these ones: (sadly not mine)

[Atlantia]

Hi bud,

Yeah the fixed blade ones are beautiful.
But I do like these folders, and they are the ones that tend to have the great inscriptions on the blades

[Atlantia]

I'm shocked that noboby has come in to discuss the beautiful fixed blade Vendetta daggers, but I'm also suprised there is no interest in these large folders?
They date back into 19thC and tend to have colourful inscriptions like: 'May your wounds be mortal' or 'You go straight to the heart of the enemy' etc.

[Chris Evans]

Atlantia,

I don't know all that much about these folders, except that most were made in France.

What I consider significant about them, as with many French "navajas", is that despite the fierce wording of the inscribed legends and often large size, they lacked a mechanical lock that would render them safe (for the wielder) for thrusting. As such, I strongly suspect that they were not intended for violent use, rather souvenirs, or at most, common cutting implements designed to fit in with restrictve laws.

That so many ornate Spanish and French folders survive to this day, without the usual signs or repeated sharpening and other wear and tear associated with regular usage, strongly suggests that these were display pieces or souvenirs.

As collectors, we gravitate towards the most attractive and well preserved specimens and over time this acts as a filter and removes from circulation those less attractive implements that were used in earnest.

Cheers
Chris

[Atlantia]

Originally Posted by Chris Evans

Atlantia,

I don't know all that much about these folders, except that most were made in France.

What I consider significant about them, as with many French "navajas", is that despite the fierce wording of the inscribed legends and often large size, they lacked a mechanical lock that would render them safe (for the wielder) for thrusting. As such, I strongly suspect that they were not intended for violent use, rather souvenirs, or at most, common cutting implements designed to fit in with restrictve laws.

That so many ornate Spanish and French folders survive to this day, without the usual signs or repeated sharpening and other wear and tear associated with regular usage, strongly suggests that these were display pieces or souvenirs.

As collectors, we gravitate towards the most attractive and well preserved specimens and over time this acts as a filter and removes from circulation those less attractive implements that were used in earnest.

Cheers
Chris

Hi Chris,

Well, TBH I think you are being a bit unkind about the folders.
Absolutely they are 'souvenir' items (you can see mine has 'Souvenir De Bastia' on the grip), but then so really are many Spanish, South American, and many other blades of the same period.
I think you are quite right that they were made to also accomodate a tightening of laws as with Navajas.
As for the lack of a lock. The one I have would serve the purpose perfectly well without, having as it does a tremendously rigid spring that 'snaps' the blade into place. Its a full two handed job to close the damn thing.
As for use... well I can't see it being a good utility knife in all honesty, it feels like its made for stabbing and not much else. So I can't see them really being used or needing sharpening.
I'm certainly a novice when it comes to these, and although I've owned many 'navajas' over the years this is the first os these Corsican variants that I've owned.
So I can't comment on mainland French made versions, but this one certainly claims to have been made by Robert Badani in Bastia on Corsica.

I wish I knew a little more about him as I'd like to date the knife. It has the feel of folders made around 1900 that I've owned which would put it within an era where Vendetta fueds still allegedly regularly took place, making it at the very least an extraordinarily lethal contemporary souvenir of a somewhat macarbre piece of European history.

Which is why I'm suprised more people don't like them? Especially given the interest in plain old Spanish Navajas!

Best
Gene

[Chris Evans]

Hi Gene,

Originally Posted by Atlantia

Hi Chris,

Well, TBH I think you are being a bit unkind about the folders.

Sorry, didn't mean to be disparaging in any way at all, because as souvenir items they are highly collectable. I myself have a number of those garishly decorated oversized navajas that bear the all telling "Recuerdo de....". (souvenir of...) and paid plenty for them.

Absolutely they are 'souvenir' items (you can see mine has 'Souvenir De Bastia' on the grip), but then so really are many Spanish, South American, and many other blades of the same period.

Indeed. And this is why I go out of my way to point in the various discussions that these knives were not normative and try to dispel the fanciful pseudo history that have been spun around them.

I think you are quite right that they were made to also accomodate a tightening of laws as with Navajas.

The French, as did the English and Germans, had a massive export cutlery industry and made locking systems to fit in with their target markets. In the 19th century Spain bough millions of French made nvajas, most without a lock.

As for the lack of a lock. The one I have would serve the purpose perfectly well without, having as it does a tremendously rigid spring that 'snaps' the blade into place. Its a full two handed job to close the damn thing.

All the French made ones that I have seen had what I call the `demi-lock' which required more force to close than a common slip joint, but still met restrictive ordnances. As for using them to thrust, well, yes one could do so, but at a risk and along the way a well directed blow with a parrying jacket could easily close the blade onto the fingers of the wielder. This is why the mechanical lock was illegal in Spain and I suspect also in many other jurisdictions, as is the case now in England, as I am told. Forton himself commented on this matter at quite some length in his book on navajas.

As for use... well I can't see it being a good utility knife in all honesty, it feels like its made for stabbing and not much else. So I can't see them really being used or needing sharpening.

I agree with you entirely. A large folding knife fitted with a demi-lock, is a dangerous item to open and close when sharp.

So I can't comment on mainland French made versions, but this one certainly claims to have been made by Robert Badani in Bastia on Corsica.

Bernard Levine, the renowned authority on knives, is forever pointing out to collectors that what is stamped on a blade does not necessarily indicate the name of the manufacturer. It is a well entrenched practice in the cutlery industry for importers to order knives from foreign manufacturers with their own name on them. Your knife may or may not have been made in Corsica, but Thiers remains a prime suspect.

As an aside, the same applies to a large number of very French looking navajas that bear the name of Spanish cutlery outlets. This was debated some time ago on a Spanish forum and nobody could confirm if the ubiquitous Valero Jun of Zaragoza made his own knives or bought them on order from France with his name stamped - Because of their good quality I suspect that they were imports.

I wish I knew a little more about him as I'd like to date the knife. It has the feel of folders made around 1900 that I've owned which would put it within an era where Vendetta fueds still allegedly regularly took place, making it at the very least an extraordinarily lethal contemporary souvenir of a somewhat macarbre piece of European history.

Vendettas are common all over the Latin world to this day, but they are rarely committed with fancy knives. Don't know if they ever were, as usually such weapons are quickly discarded.

Which is why I'm surprised more people don't like them? Especially given the interest in plain old Spanish Navajas!

Well, the same could be said for the folders made by the French for their own domestic use. They made large folding knives every bit as good or better than the Spaniards.

The Spanish decided to project a national identity, to attract tourists, based on the very distinctive culture of the country's south and gypsies. The navaja has become a much publicized icon of this image, a bit like the Scottish dirk in the sock is part of that country's image, along with kilts and bagpipes. To be sure, navajas were an everyday item in pre 1900 Spain, but not necessarily the ornate large "santolios" that we associate with the term, rather cheap friction folders, as all over Europe - There are importation figures and other evidence that supports this view.

Cheers
Chris

[Montino Bourbon]

In this case means "Corsican", not a race or a run.