Appreciation

Jean · 15th July 2010, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

So, that's how I buy, but why do I buy?

I don't really know, except that it is what I do.

Dear all,
I basically agree with what has been said but just want to add this:

Collecting is a state of mind and an addiction (ask your family and friends) but unlike drinking, gambling, or taking drugs it is a positive one in my opinion.
Best regards
Jean

Rick · 15th July 2010, 11:13 PM

Jean, addiction is a bit strong; no ?

An Addict would bankrupt himself collecting ...

For me; I collect when I can; but I know someday it will also be time for me to stop .
I will be content with what I have .

A collection can be a great burden on one's heirs .
Museums just let 'em rust .

Laowang · 16th July 2010, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Jean, addiction is a bit strong; no ?

An Addict would bankrupt himself collecting ...

For me; I collect when I can; but I know someday it will also be time for me to stop .
I will be content with what I have .

A collection can be a great burden on one's heirs .
Museums just let 'em rust .

Apropos of your posting, Rick:

When there is possession, there must be loss of possession; when there is a gathering together, there must be a scattering - this is the constant principle in things. Someone loses a bow; another person finds a bow; what's so special in that? The reason why I have recorded this story from beginning to end in such detail is to let it serve as a warning for scholars and collectors in later generations.

from Records on Metal and Stone, Li Qing-zhao, written during the second year of the Shao-xing Reign (1132), Song Dynasty, China

The collecting of things appears to fulfill some deep-seated need on our part as humans; my only disagreement with Alan's hypothesis would be that it is not just a modern phenomenon, as we can date collecting in China to as far back as the Han Dynasty (206 BCE - 220 CE). Perhaps the need for refuge from everyday life was as great back then as it is now.

A. G. Maisey · 16th July 2010, 01:01 AM

Laowang, your quotation is accurate and appropriate, and cannot be faulted.

However, I will offer one correction:-

I have not put forward a hypothesis.

What I am looking for is the opinions of others in respect of the foundations of our appreciation of those things which we may choose to collect.

Rick · 16th July 2010, 01:53 AM

Should we look to the fetish bag as possibly the first incarnation of collecting ?

A. G. Maisey · 16th July 2010, 05:12 AM

Rick, what started my reflections upon this question was what I understood as related in my first post.

It appears that when we encounter something we think about that something not objectively, in isolation from all our previous experience, but subjectively . It appears that we cannot but react in this way. So, when we encounter something that relates to our field of collecting we are already thinking about that something in terms of what we already have in our minds. In other words, we cannot but help to "buy the story".

Perhaps not the story that is laid before us by Mr. Shonk, but rather the story that we probably self generated in our own sub-conscious from various inputs over a length of time. If asked, we could probably not even identify the "story" that is influencing us.

My enquiry is an attempt to get each of us to try to look into the very foundations of his own urge to collect.

We might have one person who identifies his collecting urge with investment, perhaps because of something he read or some experience that has convinced him he is wiser to place money into matchbox cars than into blue chips.

We might have somebody who begins to float (mentally , a la morphine) when he handles particular type of paper weight.

Perhaps a type of hairpin might take somebody back to childhood in grandma's house, so that person collects hairpins, in order to revisit a gentler time with each handling of a hairpin. The collector of hairpins probably does not consciously know this, but he or she does know that when the hairpin is handled an indefinable warm glow occurs.

All sorts of different things could cause all sorts of different reactions, and these different causes are currently what my thoughts are concerned with.

You told us that you "read a short story", and that awkened your interest in the keris. Very well, accepted. But what did that short story implant into your mind, and what effect does that implantation have upon your perception and appreciation of the keris?

Do you understand where I'm going with this?

Rick · 16th July 2010, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Rick, what started my reflections upon this question was what I understood as related in my first post.

these different causes are currently what my thoughts are concerned with.

You told us that you "read a short story", and that awkened your interest in the keris. Very well, accepted. But what did that short story implant into your mind, and what effect does that implantation have upon your perception and appreciation of the keris?

Do you understand where I'm going with this?

Alan, you know that I am not the most eloquent of communicators .

So I must quote; this is a snippet of the implant and the dream and longing it awoke :

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We knew him in those unprotected days when we were content to hold in our hands our lives and our property. None of us, I believe, has any property now, and I hear that many, negligently, have lost their lives; but I am sure that the few who survive are not yet so dim-eyed as to miss in the befogged respectability of their newspapers the intelligence of various native risings in the Eastern Archipelago. Sunshine gleams between the lines of those short paragraphs--sunshine and the glitter of the sea. A strange name wakes up memories; the printed words scent the smoky atmosphere of to-day faintly, with the subtle and penetrating perfume as of land breezes breathing through the starlight of bygone nights; a signal fire gleams like a jewel on the high brow of a sombre cliff; great trees, the advanced sentries of immense forests, stand watchful and still over sleeping stretches of open water; a line of white surf thunders on an empty beach, the shallow water foams on the reefs; and green islets scattered through the calm of noonday lie upon the level of a polished sea, like a handful of emeralds on a buckler of steel.

There are faces too--faces dark, truculent, and smiling; the frank audacious faces of men barefooted, well armed and noiseless. They thronged the narrow length of our schooner's decks with their ornamented and barbarous crowd, with the variegated colours of checkered sarongs, red turbans, white jackets, embroideries; with the gleam of scabbards, gold rings, charms, armlets, lance blades, and jewelled handles of their weapons. They had an independent bearing, resolute eyes, a restrained manner; and we seem yet to hear their soft voices speaking of battles, travels, and escapes; boasting with composure, joking quietly; sometimes in well-bred murmurs extolling their own valour, our generosity; or celebrating with loyal enthusiasm the virtues of their ruler. We remember the faces, the eyes, the voices, we see again the gleam of silk and metal; the murmuring stir of that crowd, brilliant, festive, and martial; and we seem to feel the touch of friendly brown hands that, after one short grasp, return to rest on a chased hilt."

Bang !!!

I was a goner .
I had my connection to the dreams, longings, and adventure of my Youth in something tangible .

15th July 2010, 11:13 PM	#2
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Jean, addiction is a bit strong; no ? An Addict would bankrupt himself collecting ... For me; I collect when I can; but I know someday it will also be time for me to stop . I will be content with what I have . A collection can be a great burden on one's heirs . Museums just let 'em rust . Last edited by Rick; 15th July 2010 at 11:26 PM.

16th July 2010, 01:01 AM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Laowang, your quotation is accurate and appropriate, and cannot be faulted. However, I will offer one correction:- I have not put forward a hypothesis. What I am looking for is the opinions of others in respect of the foundations of our appreciation of those things which we may choose to collect.

16th July 2010, 01:53 AM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,339	Should we look to the fetish bag as possibly the first incarnation of collecting ?

16th July 2010, 05:12 AM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,015	Rick, what started my reflections upon this question was what I understood as related in my first post. It appears that when we encounter something we think about that something not objectively, in isolation from all our previous experience, but subjectively . It appears that we cannot but react in this way. So, when we encounter something that relates to our field of collecting we are already thinking about that something in terms of what we already have in our minds. In other words, we cannot but help to "buy the story". Perhaps not the story that is laid before us by Mr. Shonk, but rather the story that we probably self generated in our own sub-conscious from various inputs over a length of time. If asked, we could probably not even identify the "story" that is influencing us. My enquiry is an attempt to get each of us to try to look into the very foundations of his own urge to collect. We might have one person who identifies his collecting urge with investment, perhaps because of something he read or some experience that has convinced him he is wiser to place money into matchbox cars than into blue chips. We might have somebody who begins to float (mentally , a la morphine) when he handles particular type of paper weight. Perhaps a type of hairpin might take somebody back to childhood in grandma's house, so that person collects hairpins, in order to revisit a gentler time with each handling of a hairpin. The collector of hairpins probably does not consciously know this, but he or she does know that when the hairpin is handled an indefinable warm glow occurs. All sorts of different things could cause all sorts of different reactions, and these different causes are currently what my thoughts are concerned with. You told us that you "read a short story", and that awkened your interest in the keris. Very well, accepted. But what did that short story implant into your mind, and what effect does that implantation have upon your perception and appreciation of the keris? Do you understand where I'm going with this?