Naval sword- opinions,please

M ELEY · 2nd June 2005, 05:56 PM

Oh well...couldn't get it to pull up that way. I just won this sword and was seeking the opinions of the folks here. It's eBay item # 653366647. I just received it in the mail and am curious as to its origin. In my own opinion, I think this could be American, post-Rev War. It is similar in pattern to the so-called "figure 8" hilted swords of the 1780-1810 period. Its corrigated hilt indicates post 1800 date. It is similar to the British M1845 patterns, but I'm convinced it predates them. Its blade is only sharp at the end, is strangely/sharply curved, making it different from most British patterns, and has a wedge-shaped non-fullered blade. The hilt is not the typical patterns of anything I've seen. You'll note that the blade was strengthened by a brazing of brass where the blade and cup-guard meet. This brass has patina to it, indicating that the sword was either originally made this way, or its an old repair during its working life. My question is, did American naval swords of the Federalist period/war of 1812 have swords like this? Could this be colonial Spain? The brazing-is this seen on American swords of this period. I've seen ones in Neumann's that were strengthened with lead. I know many naval swords of this period were "private purchase", but as I understand it, didn't most British/European swords of this period still follow a typical pattern unlike this? This would have definately been non-regulation. Did most naval swords of this period have unfullered blades, or is this more of a tendency of American/colonial swords? Thanks all!

Jeff D · 3rd June 2005, 01:23 AM

Is there any way you can post the pictures, I am unable to get any using your links.

Jeff

M ELEY · 3rd June 2005, 02:23 AM

Let's try this again, as the first link was bad...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6533666477

Andrew · 3rd June 2005, 03:38 AM

Boy, that blade really does remind me of the sword we discussed on this old thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001880.html

The pix are long gone. I'll try to take some tomorrow and post them here for comparison.

By the way, it's good to see you posting, Mark. Welcome back.

M ELEY · 3rd June 2005, 02:11 PM

Thanks, Andrew! I still visit the site frequently (with all of this information from such esteemed sources, it would be foolish not to), but don't have much free time to post. Yes, I do remember this particular sword with its sharply curved blade. Well, thats one that didn't occur to me! There is a distinct possibility that this could be a Chinese cutlass. Still, if it weren't for the blade, I'd still assume British or American merchantman. Would like to see pics of that old sword we discussed again, though, for comparison.

Andrew · 3rd June 2005, 05:54 PM

The weather is conspiring against taking pix today, maybe tomorrow.

Certainly, the handles are very different. It's the blades that strike me as similar. It may be just the cosmetic appearance from similar pitting and age, but your description of the wedge-shape cross section had me thinking...

M ELEY · 3rd June 2005, 08:21 PM

The wedged blade does fit, especially with the dau swords. You mentioning this also got me to thinking how much the rounded-bowl guard on mine also resembles many of the Chinese guards, minus the knuckle bow. Hmmm...

2nd June 2005, 05:56 PM	#1
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	Naval sword Oh well...couldn't get it to pull up that way. I just won this sword and was seeking the opinions of the folks here. It's eBay item # 653366647. I just received it in the mail and am curious as to its origin. In my own opinion, I think this could be American, post-Rev War. It is similar in pattern to the so-called "figure 8" hilted swords of the 1780-1810 period. Its corrigated hilt indicates post 1800 date. It is similar to the British M1845 patterns, but I'm convinced it predates them. Its blade is only sharp at the end, is strangely/sharply curved, making it different from most British patterns, and has a wedge-shaped non-fullered blade. The hilt is not the typical patterns of anything I've seen. You'll note that the blade was strengthened by a brazing of brass where the blade and cup-guard meet. This brass has patina to it, indicating that the sword was either originally made this way, or its an old repair during its working life. My question is, did American naval swords of the Federalist period/war of 1812 have swords like this? Could this be colonial Spain? The brazing-is this seen on American swords of this period. I've seen ones in Neumann's that were strengthened with lead. I know many naval swords of this period were "private purchase", but as I understand it, didn't most British/European swords of this period still follow a typical pattern unlike this? This would have definately been non-regulation. Did most naval swords of this period have unfullered blades, or is this more of a tendency of American/colonial swords? Thanks all!

3rd June 2005, 01:23 AM	#2
Jeff D Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 473	Is there any way you can post the pictures, I am unable to get any using your links. Jeff

3rd June 2005, 02:23 AM	#3
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	Let's try this again, as the first link was bad... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=6533666477

3rd June 2005, 03:38 AM	#4
Andrew Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,725	Boy, that blade really does remind me of the sword we discussed on this old thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001880.html The pix are long gone. I'll try to take some tomorrow and post them here for comparison. By the way, it's good to see you posting, Mark. Welcome back.

3rd June 2005, 02:11 PM	#5
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	Thanks, Andrew! I still visit the site frequently (with all of this information from such esteemed sources, it would be foolish not to), but don't have much free time to post. Yes, I do remember this particular sword with its sharply curved blade. Well, thats one that didn't occur to me! There is a distinct possibility that this could be a Chinese cutlass. Still, if it weren't for the blade, I'd still assume British or American merchantman. Would like to see pics of that old sword we discussed again, though, for comparison.

3rd June 2005, 05:54 PM	#6
Andrew Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,725	The weather is conspiring against taking pix today, maybe tomorrow. Certainly, the handles are very different. It's the blades that strike me as similar. It may be just the cosmetic appearance from similar pitting and age, but your description of the wedge-shape cross section had me thinking...

3rd June 2005, 08:21 PM	#7
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,141	The wedged blade does fit, especially with the dau swords. You mentioning this also got me to thinking how much the rounded-bowl guard on mine also resembles many of the Chinese guards, minus the knuckle bow. Hmmm...