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Old 16th December 2004, 07:08 PM   #1
ronpakis
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Default ivory

well blu erf who knows, interesting to think what kind of ivory it could be. im always very sceptic when i hear the word ivory because it can be so many different types of material. once i have had an absolutely very nice maduran ukiran made from ivory. but when i tried to drill the hole deeper to fit my maduran keris it smelled like plastic. i have seen so many real and fakes but this one was a very nice but fake sucker a well it forces you to stay focused on whatever you buy
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Old 16th December 2004, 07:29 PM   #2
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I believe Radu is of the opinion that it is fossilized mammoth tooth ivory rather than tusk ivory. The web pattern would thus be the layers of dentin & enamel, and you can see a little "flaw" nearer the left edge that would be the beginning of the nerve channel.
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Old 16th December 2004, 09:59 PM   #3
Battara
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I would call this elephant ivory. Marine ivory is yellower and darker in nature. Fossil ivory has more bands of different colors due to different absorbtion rates of minerals in the different sections of the dentine and enamel. Here is a picture of what I mean. This is the fossil ivory pommel of a datu battle barong I have:
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Old 16th December 2004, 10:22 PM   #4
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Here is a turkish jambiya I have that has a marine (walrus) ivory hilt. Notice the yellowish hue and yet the solid middle and fragmented sides (and back) that make up the inside of the tooth: (pic sent to Lee for resizing)
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Old 17th December 2004, 11:15 PM   #5
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A nice kris though.. common among the Kelantanese and Trengganu Malays....not much likened by the them due to its simplicity and quality of besi almost equivalent to the Malay Parang of 1940s....not much priced. It looks nice honestly, but I think it has been redressed to look more outstanding ..that what most runners did before selling it to your middleman. I think, Malay forumites must contribute more rather than giving complementary comments. A 20th century keris, not a warrior keris per say but functional to a certain extent. Honestly, I like the dress. Rajamuda..I will provide you my 'insider tips'.
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Old 18th December 2004, 12:05 AM   #6
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Gee, Sakhti, i think we will all look forward to your "insider tips"
Which end of the 20th century do you believe Blu's keris is from?
What do you particularly find lacking about the besi in this piece and how much can you tell without really handing the keris?
Is simplicity of form really something disliked by the Kelantanese and Trengganu Malays? By comparison to Bali and Jawa keris i find their forms somewhat simplistic, yet there is still a beauty to it.
BTW,Where exactly are you from?
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Old 18th December 2004, 02:40 AM   #7
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Dear Sakhti,

Thank you for your comments. I'm glad you like the keris.

It is my opinion that this is not a Northen Malayan keris; It is not even a Malay keris to begin with. Everything from the sarong to the dapur and besi suggests to me that it is of Sulawesi Bugis origins. I would like to hear your arguments on why this is a N. Malay keris.

Malay parangs (which I assume you are talking about those from Pattani, Kelantan, Trengganu) are beautiful works of art, and are status symbol wear, though not as high-status as kerises. The besi used can be of high quality too. Prices of good N Malayan parangs are getting quite high these days.

There's nothing spectacular about the dress. Its old, repaired and its a perfect fit for the blade.

As for the 'warrior's keris' remark, well, in over a thousand kerises which I have handled, this keris is one of the toughest, tempered for 80% of the length, with attendant clash marks and nicks. I would presume a keris used in combat belongs to 'warriors'. What would your definition of 'warrior keris' be?

As for the age of the keris, it could well be 20th century, but probably the earlier part of 20th century. As I mentioned, I think this keris could have been forged from European steel. One of the things that late 20th Century pandai besi fall short on is the appreciation of the 'flow of the form'. They have the technical knowledge, but lesser grasp of the aesthetics. And that is often betrayed in their execution of the keris. Also, they tend to squeeze in as much perabot as they can, as if a more complicated keris is better.

A simple form does not make a keris easier to execute well. This keris here has simple form, but its execution is elegant, without compromising functionality. What more do we ask for in a keris of the fabled Sulawesi Bugis?

I look forward to hearing from you again.

Regards,
BluErf
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Old 18th December 2004, 04:31 AM   #8
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If such keris are common in Kelantan and Terengganu you could have fooled me. Fact is its even pretty unusual by Sulawesi standards - which is what makes the piece so special in the first place. Had I seen the blade bare I would have guessed Northeastern Sumatra. Here's a piece thats similar but dressed in the NE Sumatran style.



Photo stolen from Artzi.

And another from S. Sumatra with a similar blade form but somewhat different, lower quality besi.



That said, the dress on BluErf's keris is unmistakably Sulawesi.



And incidentally - the steel on this piece's blade is quite similar.



Straight keris blades are ubiquitous across the Malay world and are sometimes pretty hard to place. Complicating matters is the fact that many of the cheap Javanese trade blades sold across the archipelago for hundreds of years were straight blades. That said though this blade is clearly no trade blade. the hexagonal cross section is typically Bugis - whether Sulawesi or Straits - as is the besi. To top it all off - the quality of workmanship of Blu's example is certainly one of the best, if not the best of this sort that I've ever seen. None of the examples shown above even comes close. A very fine, certainly high status blade. To denigrate such a piece as "common" and "cheap" (I'm assuming that's what "not much priced" means) is flat ignorant!

And for the record, I've spent a hell of a lot of time trying to figure out the identifying characteristics of the keris of the Northeastern Peninsula but if there is anyone on this forum who can prove to me that such keris were common I'll be damned impressed
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