silver keris toli-toli ( comments pls)

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by Battara

So if I understand right, toli-tolis like this one are recent. What do older toli-tolis look like?

Hello Jose,

will try to take pictures from the book Senjata Pusaka Bugis at weekend.

Regards,

Detlef

[Jean]

Hello Detlef and Jose,
In this book only 2 silver toli-toli are shown and at least one of them is recent. You can see nice and old gold specimens in the books "Keris" from Dr Hamzuri (pusakas from the Jakarta Museum) and "Courts of Indonesia" by Helen Jessup.
Regards

[Sajen]

Here the pictures from the two examples shown in the above mentioned book. frankly said i don't know from which one Jean think that it is recent.

Regards,

Detlef

[Jean]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Here the pictures from the two examples shown in the above mentioned book. frankly said i don't know from which one Jean think that it is recent.

Regards,

Detlef

Hello Detlef and Jose,
The kris shown on the right of the picture has a recent sheath and hilt IMO, see another specimen with a similar embedded silver wire decoration on the bottom part of the gandar (not Sulawesi Bugis but rather from Bali/ Lombok or Sumbawa?). However this style of decoration seems a bit less recent than the spiral wires and flowers seen on the sheath shown by Mykeris. But other opinions are welcome!
Regards

[David]

Frankly, the work on this first example that MyKeris posted looks like a hot mess. The workmanship is really poor on this piece, no where near the quality of this older example that Jean has just posted. It is also far too much in regards to style. I much prefer the understated and more elegant effect of this last example.

[Battara]

Thank you all folks! What I can partially conclude is that the earlier toli-tolis are not chased but wire filigree in all the work.

I like the last example posted, and that has better craftsmanship. It has silver filigree all over instead of chasing and embossing, which I admit is more difficult in this case.

I hope I am correct in my analysis of the metal work of the earlier toli-toli.


Another question: does the presence of a toli-toli make the keris a ceremonial piece or is it a sign of nobility (or could it be both)?

[mykeris]

here some samples I manged to pick up from a blog. Sure, the best. David, I think you should survey more.

[Naga Sasra]

Hello everyone,
I have attached photos of two pieces with toli-toli, One is of a more recent make and one is quite old.
I believe we would be hasty to conclude that earlier toli-tolis are not either chased or embossed, but wire filigree. As always things are not always what they seem top be, especially when it comes to keris.
regards,
Erik

[David]

Originally Posted by Battara

...does the presence of a toli-toli make the keris a ceremonial piece or is it a sign of nobility (or could it be both)?

Though i don't mind the beauty pageant displays of fine craftsmanship here i would love to see us get into some deeper questions about toli-toli in regards to how they fit into the social structure of the keris culture of that area.It seems that new toli-toli are simply being added to dress these days for commercial purposes, attracting buyers to the fancy, shiny bobbles. I am much more interested in the original intent of this aspect of dress, who could wear it when and why. While some of the more modern made toli-toli are indeed well crafted and beautiful they just don't seem appropriate or special anymore. What is the point of a king's crown when everybody is wearing one?