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Old 12th March 2007, 10:24 PM   #1
Bill M
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Default Old Dutch "Hembrug" Klewang

The seller, Arjan, says, "The Klewang was designed for use in the tropical colonies. In the first wars with the natives many soldiers were suprised by the fierce Aceh warriors in close combat. "

"Sometimes the distance between the fighting parties was so close that it needed a better weapon than the usual sabre. The answer was the klewang."

"One hand on the carabine (carbine) and in the other the klewang was the common postion to resist the native warrior attacks."
This succeeded where the rifle and the bayonet were less successful.

"This klewang is one of them and is in a very good state. The scabbard is of nice polished dark brown leather. The blade is stamped "Hembrug". Hembrug Klewangs are quite rare because they are the first made examples."


This piece is also of interest to me as it was made for the Royal Netherlands East Indies Army (Koninklijk Nederlands Indisch Leger; KNIL). Formed by royal decree March 1830. This was the army of the Netherlands in its former colony of the Netherlands East Indies (also known as the Dutch East Indies, and later known as Indonesia).

KNIL was involved in many campaigns against indigenous groups in the Netherlands East Indies including the Padri War (1821-1845), the Java War (1825-1830), crushing the Puputan (the final resistance of Bali inhabitants to colonial rule), and the prolonged Aceh War (1873-1901).
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Old 12th March 2007, 10:52 PM   #2
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Very Nice !
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Old 13th March 2007, 04:24 AM   #3
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Default dutch klewang

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Marsh
The seller, Arjan, says, "The Klewang was designed for use in the tropical colonies. In the first wars with the natives many soldiers were suprised by the fierce Aceh warriors in close combat. "

"Sometimes the distance between the fighting parties was so close that it needed a better weapon than the usual sabre. The answer was the klewang."

"One hand on the carabine (carbine) and in the other the klewang was the common postion to resist the native warrior attacks."
This succeeded where the rifle and the bayonet were less successful.

"This klewang is one of them and is in a very good state. The scabbard is of nice polished dark brown leather. The blade is stamped "Hembrug". Hembrug Klewangs are quite rare because they are the first made examples."


This piece is also of interest to me as it was made for the Royal Netherlands East Indies Army (Koninklijk Nederlands Indisch Leger; KNIL). Formed by royal decree March 1830. This was the army of the Netherlands in its former colony of the Netherlands East Indies (also known as the Dutch East Indies, and later known as Indonesia).

KNIL was involved in many campaigns against indigenous groups in the Netherlands East Indies including the Padri War (1821-1845), the Java War (1825-1830), crushing the Puputan (the final resistance of Bali inhabitants to colonial rule), and the prolonged Aceh War (1873-1901).


very nice sword you have.
I also have a hembrug klewang, I never notice how old it is. The iron is much better than MILSCO klewang
but there is several difference with yours. there is 'R' mark, the hand guard, there is a small 'curve' on the tip.
the hand guard seem a little different. have a look please.
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Old 13th March 2007, 06:01 AM   #4
Ian
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Default These are interesting swords

We had an interesting discussion of the Dutch klewang a while back -- here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=1132

I have one similar to your's, Bill, with a similar sheath. Mine is not marked, however.

Ian.
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Old 13th March 2007, 04:34 PM   #5
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i have one made in solingen,

the design gets around alot. apparently the dutch General Van Heutsz who commissioned the first ones had some made in germany as well as his local supplier couldn't make them fast enough....






i have seen references to the japanese issuing captured indonesian ones to their own forces. mine was supposedly captured from a german e-boat in ww2, i aquired it in the late 80's, so we have the dutch/germans/USA/japenese and who knows who else all using exactly the same design. cold steel makes a modern replica also.


AHA! - we also had a discussion HERE which was a bit off topic.HERE
starting about post no. 16

there is a linky in my last post there to a thread by paul hansen, his 2nd post down is very informative (and indicates my solingen one was probably the earliest version) thread by paul hansen

extract from that thread:

In the Aceh (northern Sumatra, Indonesia) war (end 19th, early 20th C.) the Dutch colonial troops were fighting a losing battle against effective guerilla fighters.

A new commander, General Van Heutsz, arrived and ordered the formation of small "companies" (so-called Marechaussee (Military Police) brigades) armed with short sabres of a mixed European-Indonesian design. This design was named Marechaussee Klewang. Early versions featured a Sumatran Klewang blade (straight or very slightly curved, with very wide tip), but eventually those were replaced by a more European clippoint blade. Production also shifted to Europe. First to Solingen, then to the Netherlands (Hembrug).

Van Heutsz' tactics were ruthless but highly effective. The same classification could be used for the Klewang: ruthless but highly effective in jungle warfare.

Apparently someone high in the US Navy was impressed and ordered a somewhat similar sword (but without the cut-out guard) in the US. This is the M1917.

Just before the war, the Royal Netherlands Indies Army (KNIL) wanted to purchase a very large amount of Klewangs. They were ordered in the Netherlands, but the Netherlands were overrun by the Germans before they could be delivered.

As ordering in Germany wasn't an option, the KNIL turned to US manufacturers. The US company Milsco got a contract for a large number of klewangs. Before they could all be delivered, the Dutch East Indies were also overrun. Without a paying customer, the US military took a lot of these swords into service as M1941. They did serve in the US army and marine corps, but perhaps not as an official item.

After WW2, many of the unissued Milso klewangs were bought by the Dutch government and used in the "policing actions" in Indonesia in the late 40's. Others found their way to the collectors market in new condition.

The definitive book on the subject is "Klewang" by J.P. Puype & R.J. de Stürler Boekwijt. Highly recommended!

Last edited by kronckew : 13th March 2007 at 04:53 PM.
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Old 13th March 2007, 10:38 PM   #6
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You got yourself a Dutchie.
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Old 14th March 2007, 08:56 AM   #7
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Default the age of hembrug klewang

Quote:
Originally Posted by kronckew
i have one made in solingen,

the design gets around alot. apparently the dutch General Van Heutsz who commissioned the first ones had some made in germany as well as his local supplier couldn't make them fast enough....






i have seen references to the japanese issuing captured indonesian ones to their own forces. mine was supposedly captured from a german e-boat in ww2, i aquired it in the late 80's, so we have the dutch/germans/USA/japenese and who knows who else all using exactly the same design. cold steel makes a modern replica also.


AHA! - we also had a discussion HERE which was a bit off topic.HERE
starting about post no. 16

there is a linky in my last post there to a thread by paul hansen, his 2nd post down is very informative (and indicates my solingen one was probably the earliest version) thread by paul hansen

extract from that thread:

In the Aceh (northern Sumatra, Indonesia) war (end 19th, early 20th C.) the Dutch colonial troops were fighting a losing battle against effective guerilla fighters.

A new commander, General Van Heutsz, arrived and ordered the formation of small "companies" (so-called Marechaussee (Military Police) brigades) armed with short sabres of a mixed European-Indonesian design. This design was named Marechaussee Klewang. Early versions featured a Sumatran Klewang blade (straight or very slightly curved, with very wide tip), but eventually those were replaced by a more European clippoint blade. Production also shifted to Europe. First to Solingen, then to the Netherlands (Hembrug).

Van Heutsz' tactics were ruthless but highly effective. The same classification could be used for the Klewang: ruthless but highly effective in jungle warfare.

Apparently someone high in the US Navy was impressed and ordered a somewhat similar sword (but without the cut-out guard) in the US. This is the M1917.

Just before the war, the Royal Netherlands Indies Army (KNIL) wanted to purchase a very large amount of Klewangs. They were ordered in the Netherlands, but the Netherlands were overrun by the Germans before they could be delivered.

As ordering in Germany wasn't an option, the KNIL turned to US manufacturers. The US company Milsco got a contract for a large number of klewangs. Before they could all be delivered, the Dutch East Indies were also overrun. Without a paying customer, the US military took a lot of these swords into service as M1941. They did serve in the US army and marine corps, but perhaps not as an official item.

After WW2, many of the unissued Milso klewangs were bought by the Dutch government and used in the "policing actions" in Indonesia in the late 40's. Others found their way to the collectors market in new condition.

The definitive book on the subject is "Klewang" by J.P. Puype & R.J. de Stürler Boekwijt. Highly recommended!


the estimated age of the hembrug klewang .....
any body know how old is the klewang?
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Old 7th October 2007, 04:38 AM   #8
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This thread was fascinating to read, the history of military klewangs, beautifully recounted by Kronckew in his post with outstanding contributions and illustrations by Ferylaki and Bill Marsh.

In the last words of the post, the question on the age of the klewang was well placed, but no response was ever made. It would be interesting to know more on the history of the klewang that led to these military versions.

Can anyone note earliest known examples and history of the klewang in development?
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Old 7th October 2007, 10:13 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Marsh
The seller, Arjan, says, "The Klewang was designed for use in the tropical colonies. In the first wars with the natives many soldiers were suprised by the fierce Aceh warriors in close combat. "

"Sometimes the distance between the fighting parties was so close that it needed a better weapon than the usual sabre. The answer was the klewang."

"One hand on the carabine (carbine) and in the other the klewang was the common postion to resist the native warrior attacks."
This succeeded where the rifle and the bayonet were less successful.

"This klewang is one of them and is in a very good state. The scabbard is of nice polished dark brown leather. The blade is stamped "Hembrug". Hembrug Klewangs are quite rare because they are the first made examples."


This piece is also of interest to me as it was made for the Royal Netherlands East Indies Army (Koninklijk Nederlands Indisch Leger; KNIL). Formed by royal decree March 1830. This was the army of the Netherlands in its former colony of the Netherlands East Indies (also known as the Dutch East Indies, and later known as Indonesia).

KNIL was involved in many campaigns against indigenous groups in the Netherlands East Indies including the Padri War (1821-1845), the Java War (1825-1830), crushing the Puputan (the final resistance of Bali inhabitants to colonial rule), and the prolonged Aceh War (1873-1901).





In 1898 first militairy weapon came in use as marchausse sabel not before


Ben
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Old 7th October 2007, 12:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dajak
In 1898 first militairy weapon came in use as marchausse sabel not before


Ben


Hi Ben,

I believe you mean the Marechaussee Sabel? I would like to know more. Are there any online sources?

The information I quoted on the KNIL comes from

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KNIL

"As such, KNIL was involved in many campaigns against indigenous groups in the Netherlands East Indies including the Padri War (1821-1845), the Java War (1825-1830), crushing the Puputan (the final resistance of Bali inhabitants to colonial rule) of 1849, and the prolonged Aceh War (1873-1904)."

And

http://www.awm.gov.au/alliesinadver...panese/army.asp

But there may be more pertinent information on the Marechaussee Sabel, if you would be so kind as to supply?
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Old 7th October 2007, 01:05 PM   #11
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the dutch royal guard's variation, the Koninklijke Marechaussee

has a different grip and scabbard.


Koninklijke Marechaussee sabel

(from this linky)

there are two of these variants up on ebay at the moment.
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Old 7th October 2007, 01:46 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kronckew
the dutch royal guard's variation, the Koninklijke Marechaussee

has a different grip and scabbard.


Koninklijke Marechaussee sabel

(from this linky)

there are two of these variants up on ebay at the moment.


This version is earlyer and was to long to fight in the jungle it is and used more at an Gala

later they wanna have the leather sheet better in the jungle can be read at the second link

Ben

Ben
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Old 7th October 2007, 02:13 PM   #13
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mmmmm they our nice Ive had a couple that were shortened & reground by the Japanese in ww2 for machete use & prison guard use.

The Best machete ever by quality probably!

Never had the full length one.

These were as Dajak says Definatly first issued in 1898 according to Netherlands Army Museum curater in Delft who wrote the book about the 140 variations they have in thier collection.

This website does English....

museum linky...

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Old 7th October 2007, 01:26 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Marsh
Hi Ben,

I believe you mean the Marechaussee Sabel? I would like to know more. Are there any online sources?

The information I quoted on the KNIL comes from

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KNIL

"As such, KNIL was involved in many campaigns against indigenous groups in the Netherlands East Indies including the Padri War (1821-1845), the Java War (1825-1830), crushing the Puputan (the final resistance of Bali inhabitants to colonial rule) of 1849, and the prolonged Aceh War (1873-1904)."

And

http://www.awm.gov.au/alliesinadver...panese/army.asp

But there may be more pertinent information on the Marechaussee Sabel, if you would be so kind as to supply?


Hi Bill it is in Dutch
The klewang is the indonesian term off this marchaussee sabel later they called this klewang
Marchausse sabel is the offical dutch term

In 1898 it was first in use with the KNIL not before

Ben


the last link says of yours The Klewang is a type of cutlass which originally derived from the weapons traditionally carried by Indonesian natives, and was later adopted by soldiers of the Dutch East India Company (the Vereenigde Oostindische Compagnie or VOC). By the 1930s, it was carried as a sidearm by native police in the NEI. Some were used in combat against the Japanese, but they were more commonly employed as machetes against jungle foliage. The Klewang remained on issue to Dutch forces after the war, and was used during actions against Indonesian rebels as late as 1947–48.
RELAWM24941
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Old 7th October 2007, 01:30 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dajak
Hi Bill it is in Dutch
The klewang is the indonesian term off this marchaussee sabel later they called this klewang
Marchausse sabel is the offical dutch term

In 1898 it was first in use with the KNIL not before

Ben



Thank you Ben, I have translation utiilities that can render Dutch into English. I am not trying to be difficult, just to broaden my horizons. Link?
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Old 7th October 2007, 01:41 PM   #16
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http://collectie.legermuseum.nl/sit...20k lewang.pdf


this link says that knil people did take indonesian klewangs



this one that they take the model you have

http://www.collectie.legermuseum.nl...sseesab el.pdf


Hope you like it Bill let me now if you like to see more

Ben
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