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Old 6th February 2014, 01:25 AM   #1
VANDOO
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Talking OFF TOPIC JUST FOR FUN BUT SLIGHTLY RELATED: SEA MONSTERS

THE LEGENDS OF SEA MONSTERS GOES BACK A LONG WAY AND THE ARTISTIC RENDERINGS THAT RESULTED FROM DRAWING FROM STORIES WITH NO FIRST HAND KNOWLEGE OF THE SUBJECT. WE TEND TO TELL STORIES OF STRANGE BEASTS AND MAKE THEM MORE FIERCE, WINGS, FANGS, TUSKS, CLAWS AND MANES SPROUT FROM DRAWINGS WHERE NONE EVER EXHISTED IN REALITY. SO DRAGONS WITH MANES WHALES WITH TUSKS AND LARGE ARMS AND CLAWED FEET WERE ACCEPTED IN ANCIENT TIMES AND MOST ARTISTS DREW THEIR INSPIRATION FROM THEM. THEY SEEMED POPULAR IN WEAPONS DESIGNS AND ON OLD WORLD MAPS AMONG OTHER THINGS.
THERE ARE DEPICTIONS OF SEA MONSTERS ON POTTERY AND MOSAICS THAT HAVE SURVIVED SINCE BEFORE 1000 B.C.
PICTURES
#1. 1558 SEA MONSTER LION COMPLETE WITH MANE
#2. 1572 SEA MONSTER FROM A OLD MAP
#3. 1558 SEA MONSTER, FANCIFUL WALE
#4. 1560 SEA MONSTER
#5. 1558 WALRUS
#6. 1603 SEA MONSTER FROM MAP
#7. 1613 SEA MONSTERS, ONE A SHARK AND THE OTHER A UNICORN WITH A SAWFISH BILL FOR A HORN.
#8. 1755 SEA MONSTER WITH MANE

PERHAPS THE FIRST PICTURE IS A SEA LION IF SOMEONE DESCRIBED AN ANIMAL TO A ARTIST WHO NEVER SAW ONE AND CALLED IT A SEA LION THIS MAY BE THE RESULT. I HAVE HEARD BOTH SEALS AND SAILORS REFERRED TO AS SEA DOGS. PERHAPS THE SEALS EARNED IT WITH THEIR LOUD BARKING I AM NOT SURE HOW THE SAILORS EARNED THE NAME. THOSE WHO SAILED THE SEAS IN THE EARLY DAYS NO DOUBT FEARED THE LARGE WALES AS THEY WERE LARGE AND MYSTERIOUS BEASTS SO THEY PROBABLY TRYED TO AVOID THEM. THEY COULD NOT TELL WHAT THEY REALLY LOOKED LIKE OR HOW LARGE THEY REALLY WERE AND HAVING SOMETHING AS LARGE AS YOUR SHIP RUBBING AGAINST THE BOTTOM TO SCRATCH OFF ITCHY BARNACLES NO DOUBT TERRIFIED THEM. WHALERS NO DOUBT EXAGGERATED HOW DANGEROUS THEIR PREY WAS TO GAIN RESPECT AND TELL A GOOD TALE.
THE SEA STILL HIDES MANY MYSTERYS TODAY BUT IN THE EARLY DAYS IT WAS FILLED WITH THE UNKNOWN AND A FEARSOM AND MYSTERIOUS PLACE INDEED.
THE LION WAS WIDELY DISTRIBUTED IN EARLY DAYS WE EVEN HAD SOME IN THE AMERICAS IN PREHISTORIC TIMES. I THINK MAN RESPECTED THE LION MORE BECAUSE ITS WAYS ARE DIFFERENT THAN THE OTHER BIG CATS. TIGERS AND LEOPARDS, JAGUARS AND MOUNTAIN LIONS ARE SOLITARY AND NOT EASILY SEEN. LIONS LIVE AND HUNT IN PRIDES AND ARE MUCH EASIER TO LOCATE AND SEE . ALL BIG CATS INSPIRED FEAR IN MAN BUT FOR SOME REASON MAN SEEMED TO THINK LIONS MORE NOBLE AND RESPECTED THE LION MORE, EVEN ENOUGH TO NAME HIM KING OF BEASTS. NO DOUBT THE STORIES SPREAD MUCH FARTHER THAN THE LIONS RANGE AND THE FARTHER AWAY IT WENT THE MORE MAJECTIC AND FEARSOME ITS REPUTATION BECAME. EVEN HERCULES FOUGHT A LION AND AS AMERICA HAD NO LIONS DAVY CROCKET HAD TO KILL HIM A BEAR WHEN HE WAS ONLY THREE. GOOD OLD LEGENDS ARE OFT REPEATED IN MANY CULTURES AND BECOME A PART OF ITS ART AS WELL.
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Old 6th February 2014, 01:52 AM   #2
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How about the Lake monsters like the Ogopogo.

Jeff
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Old 6th February 2014, 04:38 AM   #3
Ibrahiim al Balooshi
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Salaams all..Or the Loch Ness Monster?

Vandoo when we come to historical references on monsters over on the other thread I ask that you bring on this lovely detail on monsters generally.. I see one monster has a mane!! please add your wonderful monster selection later on http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...239#post166239

Regards,
Ibrahiim al Balooshi.

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Old 6th February 2014, 03:41 PM   #4
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Interesting images, though give what actually swim in our seas in reality i don't see any appendages that needs to be interpreted as a lion's mane on any of these sea monsters.
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Old 6th February 2014, 03:55 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VANDOO
NO DOUBT THE STORIES SPREAD MUCH FARTHER THAN THE LIONS RANGE AND THE FARTHER AWAY IT WENT THE MORE MAJECTIC AND FEARSOME ITS REPUTATION BECAME. EVEN HERCULES FOUGHT A LION AND AS AMERICA HAD NO LIONS DAVY CROCKET HAD TO KILL HIM A BEAR WHEN HE WAS ONLY THREE. GOOD OLD LEGENDS ARE OFT REPEATED IN MANY CULTURES AND BECOME A PART OF ITS ART AS WELL.
Barry, there certainly are lions in the Americas, the mountain lion, also known as the cougar, and supposedly Davy Crockett did fight one, though given the amount of legend piled upon this historical character we can probably all be a little skeptical about this encounter.
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Old 7th February 2014, 06:02 AM   #6
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Lion's mane jellyfish.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Lion's mane jellyfish


Quote''The lion's mane jellyfish (Cyanea capillata), also known as hair jelly, is the largest known species of jellyfish. Its range is confined to cold, boreal waters of the Arctic, northern Atlantic, and northern Pacific Oceans, seldom found farther south than 42°N latitude. Similar jellyfish, which may be the same species, are known to inhabit seas near Australia and New Zealand. The largest recorded specimen found, washed up on the shore of Massachusetts Bay in 1870, had a bell (body) with a diameter of 7 feet 6 inches (2.29 m) and tentacles 120 feet (37 m) long. Lion's mane jellyfish have been observed below 42°N latitude for some time—specifically in the larger bays of the east coast of the United States.

While the lion's mane jellyfish generally use their stinging tentacles to prey, sea anemones can capture their tentacles, which then become tangled, torn apart and consumed.
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Old 7th February 2014, 02:51 PM   #7
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THE AMERICAN LION PANTHERA LEO ATROX LIVED DURING THE PALEOZOIC HERE IN THE AMERICAS. IT IS CLOSE TO THE SAME LION REFERRED TO IN ASIA AND EUROPE AS THE CAVE LION. THE AMERICAN LION WAS THOUGHT TO HAVE BEEN THE LARGEST IN SIZE OF THE BIG CATS AT 11.6 INCHES LONG AND 5 FOOT TALL / 3.5 X 1.7 METERS AND 700 TO 800 POUNDS. SEVERAL GOOD COMPLETE SPECIMINS HAVE BEEN FOUND IN THE LA BREA TAR PITS IN CALIFORNIA BUT FOSSILS HAVE BEEN FOUND FROM ALASKA TO FLORIDA AND IN SOUTH AMERICA AS WELL.
THE LIONS MANE JELLY FISH IS THE LARGEST KNOWN THAT CAN KILL A MAN WITH ITS STING. THE PORTUGESE MAN OF WAR AND THE SEA WASPS THOUGH MUCH SMALLER HAVE BEEN RESPONSIBLE FOR MANY MORE DEATHS. ITS KIND OF DIFFICULT NOT TO SEE A LIONS MAINE WHERE THE SEA WASP IS ESPECIALLY DIFFICULT TO SEE AND THE MAN OF WAR PRETTY ENOUGH TO ATTRACT US.
THERE HAS BEEN THE BELIEF IN ANCIENT TIMES THAT ANYTHING THAT LIVES ON LAND HAS A COUNTERPART IN THE SEA. THIS LED TO THE IDEA OF THE HALF MAN OR WOMAN HALF FISH MERMAIDS, THE SERPENTS WITH WOLF OR LION HEADS THE ZODIAC FOR CAPRICORN BEING HALF GOAT HALF FISH. THIS WAS A HINDU BELIEF AND THE MAKARA IS NO DOUBT SUCH A CREATURE. THE WORD MAKARA MAY EVEN MEAN ONE HALF LAND AND ONE HALF SEA CREATURE IN HINDU.?
THE WIDE SPREAD BELIEF IN DRAGIONS ,GIANTS ,ECT. NO DOUBT HAD VARIOUS ORIGINS ALL HAVING TO DO WITH MANS ATTEMPT TO EXPLAIN THE UNKNOWN USING IMAGINATION AND CONJECTURE. THOUGH OFTEN INCORRECT IT IS USUALLY ENTERTAINING
PICTURES 1. 1544 DRAWING OF SEA MONSTERS THE THEME OF HALF TERRESTRIAL AND HALF SEA CREATURE CAN BE SEEN IN SEVERAL DRAWINGS.
2. LIONS MANE JELLY FISH AND DIVER
3. AMERICAN CAVE LION
4. FOSSIL JAWS OF MEGALODON SHARK, HOPEFULLY EXTINCT.
5. OLD MAP DRAWING OF SEA SERPENT ATTACKING SHIP.
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Old 7th February 2014, 03:45 PM   #8
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y'all are making fun of my girlfriend, ol' one-eye.
(cthulhu's older sister)
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Old 7th February 2014, 05:17 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kronckew
y'all are making fun of my girlfriend, ol' one-eye.
(cthulhu's older sister)

OK Kronckew!! Just how many times have you seen that Pirates of the Caribbean sequel where the captain and lots of crew are humanoid/sea critter hybrids???? "

Barry, this is a brilliant thread, and well placed in its own context for discussion as this very topic has of course come up in other concurrent subjects..case in point the Sinhalese swords discussions.

As discussed there, there is a great deal of perception and 'license' involved as descriptions of unusual sea creatures (which extends of course to mythology in many ways and cases) were morphed into depictions of them in sketches, tales and lore.

Ibrahiim it is amazing that you found that example of the 'lions mane jellyfish'!!! and so interesting that the subject of lions manes and depictions of sea going mythological beasts recently discussed might have , as always, some fascinating basis in the real world. Well done!!!

I always enjoyed the Jules Verne movies and of course the novels, in particular "20,000 Leagues Under the Sea", in which one of the key features in one part was the gigantic squid. In recent times there have found living examples of huge squids which correspond dramatically with Verne's descriptions, long thought to be imagined by the visionary writer.

While not directly related to weapons, the imagery certainly may apply to decoration and inscribed imagery on arms, and from an ethnographic point of view, certain creatures such as sawfish had some of their elements actually used in weapons in Oceanic regions, their influences alone notwithstanding.
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Old 7th February 2014, 06:01 PM   #10
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me and a canadian guy, kevin le grey, have a long running sga about his pyrate ship the 'Black Duck' where he is the captain (only 'cus it's his ship). thwe forum we used sadly is now defunct.

ol' one-eye was our chief cook and bottle washer, and also kept all the prisoners we held for ransom, occasionally lopping off body parts for the crews stew if it looked like they wasn't gonna pay up. we captured the real osma bin lightbulb and she slowly whittled him down till there was very little left. the doppleganger that obama eliminated in pakinstan in 2011 was just a clone. as an elder goddess, she would occasionally heal them and grow them new parts to prolong then agony.

osma was only a foot tall when she was finished with him. one foot, one hand, part of a lung and six feet of intestine that came and went out of his mouth. she figured whatever he said was just male bovine fecal matter anyhow. his brain was only the size of a small teacup, so she shrunk his head to fit. grew it all back together. he could just about hop around waving his hand, which only had one finger (yup, the middle one, she has a wicked sense of humor).

sadly, the pirate trade has fallen off lately, too many amateurs. the ol' black ducky has been laid up and rots at the dock, and ol' one-eye flaps her way between montreal and gloucestershire for her amusement, when she's not keeping her baby brother from eating everyone and spoiling everything.

anyhow, she cleans up well, and until you've tried a tentacly snog, you ain't lived. i also include the flag of the 'Black Duck' to prove the whole story. them pirates of hollywood stole our story, which pre-existed them davey jones imitations in the POC series. ol' one eye is looking for them, as she thinks she should have been the tentacly girlfriend of captain jack (they couldn't even spell kevin's name right). she may use her dorsal spines, which she can eject at 5000fps. they can cut thru 2 ft. of chobham armour plate. they're made out of an unobtanium alloy (made from compressed higgs bosons and a dash of chanel no. 5).

ol' one eye finally let osma go, he's now employed by hillary clinton as her presidential campaign manager.
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Old 7th February 2014, 06:40 PM   #11
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...and there is more unexplored areas of the ocean yet to be revealed, who knows what may be out there. them early sketches may be right after all....
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