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Old 4th January 2024, 01:21 AM   #1
wildwolberine
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Default Bagobo ilap/sangi knife for reference

I received this item yesterday. I believe this is a Bagobo ilap or sangi knife. Unmarked blade, brass ferrule, likely banati hilt. Blade shows signs of resharpening. The ferrule is worn in spots, suggesting use? No sheath. This is my first sangi, it’s a nice little knife!

Much discussion in this thread:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...highlight=Ilap
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Old 4th January 2024, 02:57 AM   #2
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That's a big one! I bid on that also, glad it went to someone here. I like the ferule.
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Old 4th January 2024, 01:36 PM   #3
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Congrats. What were these used for? Skinning?
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Old 4th January 2024, 02:58 PM   #4
Ian
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These are general utility knives, sometimes called "women's knives" although men use them also. The blade form is found among several Lumad tribes of Mindanao—examples from the Bagobo and T'boli are the most common.
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Old 4th January 2024, 05:28 PM   #5
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Regarding names and usage.
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Old 5th January 2024, 06:02 PM   #6
Ian
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Detlef has shown a range of these knives from various indigenous Lumad groups of Mindanao.

Just to add some confusion and a word of caution, there are similar items made by Maranao Muslim craftsmen in the Lake Lanao area that are somewhat copies of these knives. They are not traditional Moro knives, but the Maranao make them for sale to tourists. Mostly these knives have brass hilts and scabbards adorned with bells.
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Old 6th January 2024, 12:01 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian View Post
Just to add some confusion and a word of caution, there are similar items made by Maranao Muslim craftsmen in the Lake Lanao area that are somewhat copies of these knives. They are not traditional Moro knives, but the Maranao make them for sale to tourists. Mostly these knives have brass hilts and scabbards adorned with bells.
Hi Ian,

There are for sure authentic knives of this type made from brass like shown in the booklet and stated from Nonoy Tan in this thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=sangi

But I guess that you speak about similar knives shown from our very missed member VANDOO in the same thread, see picture.

Regards,
Detlef
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Old 6th January 2024, 12:09 PM   #8
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I have owned four of these knives, two I've sold and two I still have in my collection, one sold one was from brass (handle/scabbard) and IMVHO authentic.
The left on the first picture is sold as the right one on the third picture.
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Old 6th January 2024, 01:09 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sajen View Post
Hi Ian,

There are for sure authentic knives of this type made from brass like shown in the booklet and stated from Nonoy Tan in this thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=sangi

But I guess that you speak about similar knives shown from our very missed member VANDOO in the same thread, see picture.

Regards,
Detlef
Detlef, that example from VANDOOS' post is what I was referring to as being of Maranao manufacture for sale to those who travel. Yes, some of the Lumad examples do have brass hilts and scabbards also, which is what makes things confusing. I have seen many Maranao examples of these knives for sale in the Philippines and online over the last 30 years.
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Old 9th June 2024, 01:34 AM   #10
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Default Unidentified knife - Mindanao?

Recent purchase. Is this knife also from Mindanao? The blade shape differs from the examples in this thread. (Seller photo.)
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Old 9th June 2024, 03:07 PM   #11
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Hi WW,


Need to have a better view of the hilt and blade. From what I can see, this could be from Mindanao. The blade shape is a bit unusual--perhaps a reshaped broken blade--although I have seen a similar profile on Lumad knives around Davao City.


Ian.
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Old 18th June 2024, 12:42 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian View Post
Hi WW,


Need to have a better view of the hilt and blade. From what I can see, this could be from Mindanao. The blade shape is a bit unusual--perhaps a reshaped broken blade--although I have seen a similar profile on Lumad knives around Davao City.


Ian.
Hi Ian!

Here are some photos of the item. It’s quite small. The blade is rusted and needs cleaning but it’s still sharp. The projection at the hilt is wood.
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Old 20th June 2024, 02:27 AM   #13
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Default Possible Unidentified Knife ID

Wildwolberine,

Your recently purchased, unidentified knife may be a surot. Check out the first blade described in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7i19CDrPmU). Your blade is much shorter and your hilt differs but I thought I’d mention it.

Sincerely,
RobT
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Old 20th June 2024, 03:39 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobT View Post
Wildwolberine,

Your recently purchased, unidentified knife may be a surot. Check out the first blade described in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7i19CDrPmU). Your blade is much shorter and your hilt differs but I thought I’d mention it.

Sincerely,
RobT
Thanks Rob! Looks like some interesting videos. I have one of those “Sinuwak” bolos.

NW
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Old 20th June 2024, 11:21 AM   #15
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WW,

Your knife is a bit of a mystery although it fits with the work knives shown above by Detlef from the book. I've extracted images from his pictures that illustrate similar blades and one hilt that has a projection similar to yours.

Regards,

Ian.
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Old 21st June 2024, 11:48 AM   #16
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Not sure if helpful, but here is knife that was a generous gift from a forum member that has a projection on the hilt. I was informed that this one is called kebahu, more of a basic utility knife than a sangi. His thoughts were the rather phallic projection was used as a scraper.
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Old 1st July 2024, 05:40 AM   #17
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Here is an example of a Bagobo sangi with bells not made in Marawi City. This is from Bagobo hands and the bells are different. Comes from National Geographic 1944, vol 86, p567. The hilt looks wood to me in this picture.
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