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Old 5th November 2017, 05:28 PM   #1
Cerjak
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Default A French percussion gun with a 27 mm diameter heavy barrel.

A French percussion gun with a 27 mm diameter heavy barrel.
The lock with maker name F Claudin A Paris
This gun with his heavy barrel look like a rampart gun but I think it is a civil hunting gun.
The weight is about 7.2 kg ,the barrel 93 cm and total 136cm
The barrel internal diameter 27 mm and external 35 mm
Any comment on it will be welcome.
Best
Cerjak
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Old 5th November 2017, 05:45 PM   #2
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smooth bore or rifled? that's really big for a large ball at 1/4 pound of lead or even more if a minie ball, if it's rifled - rather large for a shotgun too. around a 2 or 3 bore...it'd be a son of a <expletive deleted> to shoot with anything approaching a decent powder charge and shot load. fancy punt gun for market bird hunters who want to hit dozens at once? i'd want to mount it on a tripod and stand well back...

with no sights i'm going to assume it's it's a smoothbore shotgun. what's that small projection on the lower part of the stock? sling swivel? - no upper one tho.

p.s. - the inside gauge seems to be reading 16.9mm give or take, or a 16 gauge shotgun size, a ladies shotgun size, most US hunters use at least a 12 gauge.

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Old 5th November 2017, 05:46 PM   #3
fernando
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Ferdinand Claudin
célèbre famille d’armuriers du 38 boulevard des italiens à Paris.
Made around 1850 ?
There will be further marks inside the lock.
With this calibre, a "4 GAUGE", this is a big game hunting gun.
Two things surprise me Jean-Luc; your taste for such 'vulgar' pieces and how you manage to measure the bore with the pied a coulisse in that position ... like reading 16,9 mm .
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Old 5th November 2017, 08:25 PM   #4
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Très beau, bravo!
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Old 5th November 2017, 09:25 PM   #5
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Kronckew

To the measure that marks the caliber should be added 1 cm, and the measurement is 26.9 mm

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Old 6th November 2017, 11:10 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fernando
Ferdinand Claudin
.
Two things surprise me Jean-Luc; your taste for such 'vulgar' pieces and how you manage to measure the bore with the pied a coulisse in that position ... like reading 16,9 mm .

Hi Fernando,
I bought it because with this very heavy barrel & big diameter this gun is out of the ordinary.
And so could stay in my heterogeneous weapon collection.
as explained by Fernando K you have to add 1cm to have the inside diameter.
Best

Jean-Luc
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Old 6th November 2017, 03:35 PM   #7
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Wow; i have never heard of that; on the contrary, to my understanding, the actual muzzle aperture marks the calibre (bore/gauge) and the bullet to fit there has a narrower diameter... assuming we are talking smooth non rifled barrels, obviously. Why would you have to add one centimeter to quote the gun's calibre ? .
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Old 6th November 2017, 03:55 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fernando
Wow; i have never heard of that; on the contrary, to my understanding, the actual muzzle aperture marks the calibre (bore/gauge) and the bullet to fit there has a narrower diameter... assuming we are talking smooth non rifled barrels, obviously. Why would you have to add one centimeter to quote the gun's calibre ? .

Fernando,
When you using a" pied à coulisse" ,for internal diameter you have to add 1 cm to the mesure shown to have the internal diameter.
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Old 6th November 2017, 06:02 PM   #9
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Guys, where do you buy your pieds a coulisse / paquímetros / calipers ?


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Old 6th November 2017, 11:08 PM   #10
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Default Calibre o Venier

Calibre de tornero
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Old 7th November 2017, 10:56 AM   #11
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I must say that i never saw that type being used over here or out there; or that it even existed .
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Old 7th November 2017, 01:27 PM   #12
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Very nice musket Cerjak, congratulations.

Does it have a stecher-trigger (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stecher_(arme))? This would be the evidence for a hunting weapon.

Do you plan to test this beauty on a range? If it would be mine, I would definitely make a shooting range test. The sound of a 27 mm barrel must be overwhelming! My biggest caliber is a .54 pistol, which already sounds like a cannon.

To shoot with black powder is an enourmous fun, which is only outclassed by Mr. Wilson Combat Classic 1911 long slide!


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Old 7th November 2017, 03:29 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roland_M
Very nice musket Cerjak, congratulations.

Does it have a stecher-trigger (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stecher_(arme))? This would be the evidence for a hunting weapon.

Do you plan to test this beauty on a range? If it would be mine, I would definitely make a shooting range test. The sound of a 27 mm barrel must be overwhelming! My biggest caliber is a .54 pistol, which already sounds like a cannon.

To shoot with black powder is an enourmous fun, which is only outclassed by Mr. Wilson Combat Classic 1911 long slide!


Roland

Roland
I don"t see any stecher-trigger .
Yes for sure it would be very impresive to shoot with this big gun ,But I don't have any material for that and also no Knowledge.
Best

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Old 7th November 2017, 06:19 PM   #14
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Most impressive shotgun with over a 1 inch bore.
I built a 1 inch bore cannon weighing 60 pounds and with 450 g of BP it recoils over 2 feet.
I would not want to be behind this shotgun, could kill at both ends!
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Old 8th November 2017, 02:12 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerjak
Roland
I don"t see any stecher-trigger .
Yes for sure it would be very impresive to shoot with this big gun ,But I don't have any material for that and also no Knowledge.
Best

Cerjak



Cerjak,

there are at least two types of stecher-trigger, the German stecher, which has two triggers (one for the mechanism and one for the hammer) and the French stecher with only one trigger (imho better and more sophisticated than the German solution), which must be pushed forward a little bit.
Please try to push the trigger gently forward and see what happens.

If you can push the trigger to release the hammer without moving the trigger forward before, it has no French stecher-trigger.


Best,
Roland
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Old 8th November 2017, 02:17 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Will M
Most impressive shotgun with over a 1 inch bore.
I built a 1 inch bore cannon weighing 60 pounds and with 450 g of BP it recoils over 2 feet.
I would not want to be behind this shotgun, could kill at both ends!



Will,

please watch "Mae and The Wall Gun" on Youtube. I saw the video with an open mouth, she is incredible brave.

Prof. Othais WW1 gun reviews on the same channel are absolutely brilliant!


Roland
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Old 8th November 2017, 02:57 PM   #17
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Sorry my ignorance Roland ...
Is this trigger set you refer the same resource as the so called 'hair trigger' ?. If so, isn't it more a device for (sports) target shooting ? I realized a heavy game gun like that of Jean-Luc is more like for 'crude' shooting; the target to aim at being large enough .
Here is one with similar caliber (4 bore) and similar weight (7,7 Kgs.) made circa 1848 by Harris Holland for Sir Samuel Baker, who used to call it 'my baby'. It was damaged during an elephant charge and was repaired with elephant skin, covering the stock comb and lockwork.

(Courtesy "Oito Séculos de Historia em Portugal").
.

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Old 9th November 2017, 09:52 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fernando
Sorry my ignorance Roland ...
Is this trigger set you refer the same resource as the so called 'hair trigger' ?. If so, isn't it more a device for (sports) target shooting ? I realized a heavy game gun like that of Jean-Luc is more like for 'crude' shooting; the target to aim at being large enough .
Here is one with similar caliber (4 bore) and similar weight (7,7 Kgs.) made circa 1848 by Harris Holland for Sir Samuel Baker, who used to call it 'my baby'. It was damaged during an elephant charge and was repaired with elephant skin, covering the stock comb and lockwork.

(Courtesy "Oito Séculos de Historia em Portugal").
.

.


Hi Fernando,

yeah, technically "Stecher" and Hair Trigger means the same, a very light pressure on the Trigger is enough to release the hammer.

Western Revolvers had hair triggers with only ~60 gramms or two oz of trigger-weight for example. Nowadays a carry gun pistol got an average trigger weight of 2kg and more.

I think the difference is that American hair triggers are simply adjusted to release the hammer at a very low pressure (Western Revolvers or modern Ruger Colt 45 if one remove the small springs under the handles), while European stechers had an own pre-stressed mechanism.

Such triggers had been preferably used for duelling and for hunting purposes. Many better duell pistols in the 19ct. had a stecher trigger.


best wishes,
Roland

p.s. and Mae again
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2GLbXR3-HI

just
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Old 9th November 2017, 10:50 AM   #19
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I hear that in cold countries like Sweden they have different trigger adjustments between seasons, as fingers skin get stiffer during winter.
I once had a "Schuetzen" .22 carbine with a double set and a small caliber saloon pistol with an adjustable trigger. Both were operational but, as i am no shooter, got rid of them.
I trust that brave Mae doen's hurt her pretty face, or her collar bone, duting those shooting adventures .

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