Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > European Armoury
User Name
Password
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 3rd June 2012, 03:41 PM   #1
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default Oakeshott type XVIIIb with recurved arms

I always have found one of the nicest types of sword the long stabbing 2 hands sword, with recurved arms of the cross, Oakeshott type XVIIIb.
These swords were found in the literature and drawings from 1425 to about 1520, for example drawn by Albrecht Dürer and Martin Schoengrauer, see drawing Schoengrauer from 1475.
Historical examples of this type of sword are Wallace A467, nr 11829 Cluny, and the famous sword from the Bavarian National Museum, Munich (XVIIIa.5 ROMs).
Also some pictures from a true fighting sword in my collection, ex Gottlob Herbert Bidermann collection.
The sword length is 124cm, water discovery with the original handle intact.

best,
Attached Images
      

Last edited by cornelistromp : 3rd June 2012 at 03:54 PM.
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd June 2012, 05:35 PM   #2
Swordfish
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 129
Default

The sword in the Musee Cluny.

best
Attached Images
  
Swordfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd June 2012, 05:43 PM   #3
Swordfish
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 129
Default

And the sword in Munich.

Best
Attached Images
 
Swordfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd June 2012, 07:54 PM   #4
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

thanks and wallace A467
Attached Images
 
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 08:13 AM   #5
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

Altar wings. The three holy kings. Painters: Masters of Oberägeri altar Oberägeri. Tempera on wood frame: Wood. 1493 Origin: Oberägeri (ZG), Church of St. Peter and Paul consecrated 1493 Dimensions: height 191 cm, width 134.5 cm. (AG-17) Lit: 'L. Wüthrich / M. Ruoss, Catalogue of Paintings, Swiss National Museum, Zurich 1996 ', number 36
Attached Images
 
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29th July 2012, 02:10 PM   #6
fernando
Lead Moderator European Armoury
 
fernando's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Portugal
Posts: 6,266
Default

Very nice ... both sword and painting.
fernando is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th July 2012, 08:35 PM   #7
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

Thanks, Fernando
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 4th August 2012, 07:21 AM   #8
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

German knights, black knights representing st maurice, wearing swords of the above mentioned type.
Attached Images
    
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th February 2015, 09:10 PM   #9
Axel-arrow
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Default question

Hello!
What section pommel of this sword?
Axel-arrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20th February 2015, 11:12 AM   #10
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Axel-arrow
Hello!
What section pommel of this sword?


the pommel is a wheelpommel, oakeshott type H, with slight convex surfaces.

best,
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21st February 2015, 10:35 AM   #11
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

sword of post #1
Total length cm/ blade length cm /cross cm/bladewidth@cross mm/grip mm

124/97.5/21.0/33/190

best,
Jasper
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 03:18 AM   #12
bkp747
Member
 
bkp747's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 15
Default

Fantastic sword, I'm amazed at the great condition, for a "water find". It still is beautiful!
bkp747 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 09:53 AM   #13
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

actually for a waterfind the surface of this sword is somewhat oxidized.

In General, subject that there was no contact with the organic material, swords are better preserved under water than in the soil.

some come "as new" from the water after hundreds of years, fe some of the viking swords found in the river Ouse/UK in Records of the mediëval sword/Oakeshott, and other Ouse finds which have been in contact with organic material totally excavated.


for a very good water preserved sword, see for example:

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=9989

best,
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23rd February 2015, 04:28 PM   #14
Axel-arrow
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Default

Many thanks for information on a sword!
Axel-arrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st March 2015, 11:56 PM   #15
batjka
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 29
Default

Thanks for posting this. As a student of longsword fencing I am very interested in these historic examples. Do you mind telling the sword's weight please?
batjka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd March 2015, 11:04 AM   #16
cornelistromp
Member
 
cornelistromp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 888
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by batjka
Thanks for posting this. As a student of longsword fencing I am very interested in these historic examples. Do you mind telling the sword's weight please?


I'm sorry, I can give you the weight until March 2016.
the sword is on loan to the Solingen Blade museum in Germany for an exhibition this year.

I guess somewhere around 800 grams.

best,
cornelistromp is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 03:51 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.