Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Ethnographic Weapons
User Name
Password
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 26th March 2014, 03:43 AM   #1
DaveS
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 324
Default Show us your bankung

Here for viewing is a moro banking. This is the only one I have ever run across in years of collecting moro stuff. according to Cato it is one of the rarest of the moro swords. 20 inch laminated blade with a wood handle and cockatoo pommel. Does anyone own a bankung that they could post some pictures here?.........Dave.
Attached Images
            
DaveS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2014, 06:00 AM   #2
Robert
EAAF Staff
 
Robert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Centerville, Kansas
Posts: 2,136
Default

Hello Dave, Very nice bankung. This is the first one that I think I have ever seen with a cockatoo pommel. As I am still looking for one of these to add to my own collection unfortunately I have no photos to share. I know others here on the forum have posted theirs in the past so I too am looking forward to see how many of those as well as new ones will get posted here. My congratulations to you on acquiring this very interesting example.

Best,
Robert

P.S.
Where do you keep coming up with all these new toys from.
Robert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2014, 06:24 AM   #3
DaveS
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 324
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert
Hello Dave, Very nice bankung. This is the first one that I think I have ever seen with a cockatoo pommel. As I am still looking for one of these to add to my own collection unfortunately I have no photos to share. I know others here on the forum have posted theirs in the past so I too am looking forward to see how many of those as well as new ones will get posted here. My congratulations to you on acquiring this very interesting example.

Best,
Robert

P.S.
Where do you keep coming up with all these new toys from.

Robert: Almost all these toys are "old" ones. Iv'e not bought anything new for a couple of years. I think the last thing I bought was off of ebay from Rsword, a nice moro kris..........Dave.
DaveS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26th March 2014, 12:56 PM   #4
Nonoy Tan
Member
 
Nonoy Tan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 284
Default

Here is a specimen.
[IMG]
Attached Images
  
Nonoy Tan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2014, 12:49 AM   #5
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,165
Default

Hello Nonoy,

Yup, this sold recently: Good blade and a cracked hilt that can probably be fixed with some care.

BTW, am I the only one to believe this basket scabbard is a later non-Moro replacement? All other scabbard examples I saw were typical Sulu or Palawan types.

Regards,
Kai
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2014, 12:57 AM   #6
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,165
Default

Hello Dave,

Quote:
20 inch laminated blade with a wood handle and cockatoo pommel.

Thanks for posting yours - this is certainly special! The slim blade profile is quite unique!


I'm attaching a pic of my bangkung and hope others will do, too.

Regards,
Kai
Attached Images
 
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2014, 01:25 AM   #7
DaveS
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 324
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kai
Hello Dave,


Thanks for posting yours - this is certainly special! The slim blade profile is quite unique!


I'm attaching a pic of my bangkung and hope others will do, too.

Regards,
Kai

Hello Kai: Very nice bankung. Looks like it has a short sharpened back edge. Both bankungs that have been posted have basically what could be considered as a horse-hoof style pommel. Besides mine, the only other cockatoo type is the one in Catos book. I don't know if that one was his or not. Apparently, cockatoo style seems to less common........Dave.
DaveS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2014, 04:12 AM   #8
kino
Member
 
kino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 701
Default

Here's mine. I've posted this awhile back.
OAL 22.5 in. Blade 16"

I know where Kai's Bankung is hiding!
Attached Images
  
kino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2014, 05:35 AM   #9
DaveS
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 324
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kino
Here's mine. I've posted this awhile back.
OAL 22.5 in. Blade 16"

I know where Kai's Bankung is hiding!

Hey Albert: Another nice bankung They seem to be coming out of the woodwork. This one has the same style pommel as the ivory one that you got a while back. Apparently, there seems to be no real set handle type for this kind of sword............Dave.
DaveS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27th March 2014, 02:02 PM   #10
Nonoy Tan
Member
 
Nonoy Tan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 284
Default

Hi Kai,

I am not familiar with the origin of the scabbard, but assume that it was likely not rare nor special at that time. This "bangkung" was likely a farm or chopping tool and perhaps did not need an elaborate scabbard in the first place.

I am not sure if it would be appropriate to classify the scabbard as "moro" or "non-moro."

Here is a photo from Krieger's 1926 work. The basketry on the left is attributed to Basilan of the Sulu Archipelago.

Nonoy
Attached Images
 
Nonoy Tan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 30th March 2014, 10:31 PM   #11
VANDOO
(deceased)
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: OKLAHOMA, USA
Posts: 3,140
Smile

BANGKUNG IS IT A MORO SWORD THAT INFLUENCED THE BAGOBO/TIBOLI SWORDS OR THE OTHER WAY AROUND. THE BLADE FORM IS VERY SIMULAR ON MANY EXAMPLES. HERE ARE PICTURES OF SEVERAL VARIATIONS, TWO EVEN HAVE A CROOKED BLADE WITH BASIC BANKUNG FORM, IS THERE A NAME FOR THIS SWORD? PICTURES
#1.,#2. & #3. A LONG BANGKUNG MANTERIS HAD. IT WAS AT LEAST 25IN. LONG. AND HAD GOOD PATINA AND WAS IN PERFECT SHAPE.
#4., #5., #6, & #7. SAID TO BE PALAWAN, TAQBANUA TRIBE
#8. & #9. TWO EXAMPLES OF THE UNUSUAL BENT BLADED SWORD.
#10. BAGOBO/ TIBOLI SWORDS, WITH BANGKUNG LIKE BLADES.
Attached Images
          

Last edited by VANDOO : 31st March 2014 at 05:18 PM.
VANDOO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st March 2014, 08:53 AM   #12
imas560
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 179
Default

Hello all,
Here's mine.
OAL 27.5"/700mm
Attached Images
  
imas560 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st March 2014, 02:53 PM   #13
CharlesS
Member
 
CharlesS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 1,586
Default

Here are my examples. Technically the top example is NOT a bangkung, but certainly serves the same function. That shorter one is surprisingly heavier than either of the larger examples shown.

The scabbards on the top and middle one are new.
Attached Images
  

Last edited by CharlesS : 1st April 2014 at 12:56 AM.
CharlesS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st March 2014, 05:00 PM   #14
CharlesS
Member
 
CharlesS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 1,586
Default

Kino,

I think your example is, from top to bottom, the finest example I have seen of a bangkung. The lovely blade, along with the extraordinary hilt and pommel make it quite a fine piece.

The thickened reinforcement at the forte reminds me of many Indonesian klewang styles I have seen. Wonder if there has to be some influence there?
CharlesS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st March 2014, 05:08 PM   #15
CharlesS
Member
 
CharlesS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 1,586
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nonoy Tan
Hi Kai,

I am not familiar with the origin of the scabbard, but assume that it was likely not rare nor special at that time. This "bangkung" was likely a farm or chopping tool and perhaps did not need an elaborate scabbard in the first place.

I am not sure if it would be appropriate to classify the scabbard as "moro" or "non-moro."

Here is a photo from Krieger's 1926 work. The basketry on the left is attributed to Basilan of the Sulu Archipelago.

Nonoy


Nonoy,

The fact the Krieger is specific enough to call these "bolo" cases at least makes it a strong possibility that your example's blade and scabbard were, even if not born together(and they may have been), at least likely together for a very long time.

If only he had included an example of a "bolo" with them it would really give us a more decisive answer.
CharlesS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 31st March 2014, 05:16 PM   #16
cicak_cobing
Member
 
cicak_cobing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 20
Default

i never knew that there was a moro version of bangkung..
it's good to learn new stuff..
cicak_cobing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st April 2014, 09:56 AM   #17
VVV
Member
 
VVV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,635
Default

Nice to see all the variations of the Bangkung in one place.
Perhaps the last one, without a scabbard, once was as nice as Kino's?

Michael
Attached Images
    
VVV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 1st April 2014, 11:39 PM   #18
Sajen
Member
 
Sajen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Germany, Dortmund
Posts: 6,433
Default

Some very nice bankung, thank's to all for showing!
Sajen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd April 2014, 03:12 AM   #19
kino
Member
 
kino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 701
Default

Thanks for the kind words.
Day one in my possession, the bangkung was covered with rust and was pitted.
With a lot of help from a knife maker we got the blade to its current state.

Now here's a hybrid (wish it were mine), is it a BANGRIS or a KRIKUNG. No matter what it's called, I call it beautiful.

If the owner is a forum member, post some photos will ya!
Attached Images
 
kino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd April 2014, 12:15 PM   #20
CharlesS
Member
 
CharlesS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 1,586
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kino
Thanks for the kind words.
Day one in my possession, the bangkung was covered with rust and was pitted.
With a lot of help from a knife maker we got the blade to its current state.

Now here's a hybrid (wish it were mine), is it a BANGRIS or a KRIKUNG. No matter what it's called, I call it beautiful.

If the owner is a forum member, post some photos will ya!



Kino,

I have seen this piece and it is much smaller than an average kangkung. It does not have that kind of weight. I believed it was exclusively a status piece. And, no...it is not mine.

Last edited by CharlesS : 2nd April 2014 at 02:08 PM.
CharlesS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2nd April 2014, 12:33 PM   #21
Gustav
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 882
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kino

Now here's a hybrid (wish it were mine), is it a BANGRIS or a KRIKUNG. No matter what it's called, I call it beautiful.



A BANGRIS from Holstein's work. Twistcore

The back edge is quite long.
Attached Images
 
Gustav is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 07:14 AM   #22
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,165
Default

Hello Gustav,

I'd posit that this is a shandigris (with backedge)...

(This looks more like a barung-like blade for slashing rather than the chopping action most bangkung blades are optimized for.)

Regards,
Kai
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 07:58 AM   #23
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,165
Default

Hello Charles,

Quote:
I have seen this piece and it is much smaller than an average kangkung. It does not have that kind of weight. I believed it was exclusively a status piece.

It's certainly a really odd one, especially with that Chinese dragon on the hilt!

BTW, here's Artzi's description of the blade: "The blade is heavy, 20 inches long, single edged and hollow ground. It is forged from fine laminated steel."

Regards,
Kai
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 08:03 AM   #24
kai
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,165
Default

One more weird example - Moro?

I've seen a similar pommel on a kris that may be Sulu; both seem pretty roughly carved which is unusual, even for more recent pieces...

Regards,
Kai
Attached Images
 
kai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 11:29 AM   #25
CharlesS
Member
 
CharlesS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 1,586
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kai
Hello Charles,


It's certainly a really odd one, especially with that Chinese dragon on the hilt!

BTW, here's Artzi's description of the blade: "The blade is heavy, 20 inches long, single edged and hollow ground. It is forged from fine laminated steel."

Regards,
Kai



Kai,

The blade on Artzi's sword was not as wide as a traditional bangkung, especially with the unusual, somewhat extreme, narrowing at the forte. Nor did it have as thick of a spine as a traditional bangkung. It certainly didn't strike me as a utilitarian sword.
CharlesS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 12:17 PM   #26
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,681
Default

here's mine.
Attached Images
   
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 12:22 PM   #27
Spunjer
Member
 
Spunjer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Witness Protection Program
Posts: 1,681
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlesS
Kino,

I have seen this piece and it is much smaller than an average kangkung. It does not have that kind of weight. I believed it was exclusively a status piece. And, no...it is not mine.

lol, i'm pretty sure this was a typo, charles coz i know you're not referring to the water spinach:
http://mydestiny2011.org/wp-content...ds/kangkung.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kangkung

so now you're making me crave for kangkung and not a place to buy the darn thing around here, lol
Spunjer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 12:38 PM   #28
VVV
Member
 
VVV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,635
Default

I also handled Artzi's strange sword when in Baltimore and agree with Charles.
It's much to light and slim to be either a bangkris or a krikung.
Here is an example of a "typical" bangkris.

Kai, I think there already is a thread somewhere on my strange sword from Artzi that you reposted.

Michael
Attached Images
 
VVV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 03:59 PM   #29
kino
Member
 
kino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 701
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spunjer
lol, i'm pretty sure this was a typo, charles coz i know you're not referring to the water spinach:
http://mydestiny2011.org/wp-content...ds/kangkung.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kangkung

so now you're making me crave for kangkung and not a place to buy the darn thing around here, lol


LOL! I got a packet of Sinigang Soup Mix to go with that kangkung, if you ever find some.
kino is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 3rd April 2014, 04:39 PM   #30
CharlesS
Member
 
CharlesS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Greenville, NC
Posts: 1,586
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spunjer
lol, i'm pretty sure this was a typo, charles coz i know you're not referring to the water spinach:
http://mydestiny2011.org/wp-content...ds/kangkung.jpg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kangkung

so now you're making me crave for kangkung and not a place to buy the darn thing around here, lol



Ha!

Yes Ron, it was a typo and I'm a bad boy being a teacher who doesn't proofread! The time limit has elapsed for me to edit it. Thank God my students would never likely come near this site...they would love to catch me in any error!
CharlesS is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 05:35 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.