Poor condition Kindjal

shayde78 · 22nd February 2021, 08:00 PM

I'd like to get your comments on the Kindjal pictured below. This was part of a lot that I recently won. The condition of the items is not great (you may have seen the 'soussan patah-like' tulwar and the kukri in earlier posts).

Anyway, here we have what I believe is best termed a Kindjal. Its condition suggests some legitimate age, but per feedback on the kurkri thread, poor storage conditions can make an item achieve the look of a relic in an accelerated timeline. The lack of adornment and the rivets appearing to have hand forged heads suggests something from the early 20th century, and something intended for use, rather than mere decoration. The wood is deteriorated - from age or poor storage conditions? Of course, I'm been victim to wishful thinking of late, so I am willing to concede this was made last spring, and aged quickly due to the pandemic, as I know I have!

Specs:
Overall length - 21.4"
Blade length - 16.5"
Blade width - 2 7/16" (just in front of hilt)
Blade thickness - 5mm (tang as visible between handle slabs)
Weight - 13.75 oz

As always, thank you for your comments.

Sajen · 23rd February 2021, 08:17 AM

Hello Shayde,

I hope that you take my comment not harshly!
It's now the second item you post here that is in my humble opinion not a collectors item and only a rusted piece of iron and not worth to spend any work of conservation in it. You should spend your money for better remained items.

Regards,
Detlef

Kmaddock · 23rd February 2021, 09:10 AM

Hi Shayde,

In the job lot of items you got a fantastic, in my mind Sossun Pattah, you have up on another post.

So if the other items are corroded beyond normal collector value (like this Item) so be it.

I find I learn as much from relic items as much as good condition items
was there much else in the haul?

Regards,

Ken

Sajen · 23rd February 2021, 10:45 AM

In the case that the sword was together with the two corroded items and the price was correct it was indeed no mistake!

drac2k · 23rd February 2021, 04:12 PM

I think your assessment of the early 20th-century is correct and are you sure that the handle is wood rather than horn?
Since the item is in poor condition, why not practice your restoration on it, where you can experiment with some techniques that you might not normally use?

shayde78 · 23rd February 2021, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drac2k

I think your assessment of the early 20th-century is correct and are you sure that the handle is wood rather than horn?
Since the item is in poor condition, why not practice your restoration on it, where you can experiment with some techniques that you might not normally use?

Thanks for the question - I do think the hilt is wood due to the grain and the way it is flaking. I suppose I could do a hot pin test and smell the results.
Any thoughts on what kind of restoration you'd envision. Maye just a polish and replacing the grip?

shayde78 · 23rd February 2021, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kmaddock

Hi Shayde,

In the job lot of items you got a fantastic, in my mind Sossun Pattah, you have up on another post.

So if the other items are corroded beyond normal collector value (like this Item) so be it.

I find I learn as much from relic items as much as good condition items
was there much else in the haul?

Regards,

Ken

Ken,
Thanks for weighing in. I agree - the sossun pattah was the item that interested me in the lot as a whole. Being that I got 6 items for less than I would have paid for that one sword, I'm OK if the rest are not "collector's condition". I try to take good care of the items in my collection, but if one (or several) come to me in rough shape, I don't mind too much. As you say, I can learn a lot from these more damaged items, especially as I may be afforded opportunity to see how hilts were mounted, and such details that would otherwise be hidden on items in better conditions that you would never dream of taking apart. Also, and I know this is a point of some contention, I don't mind patina that indicates age and use by the original culture from which the weapon originates.

As for additional items, there were two machetes (one I haven't identified yet, the other is a 1943 Collins - a big beefy thing). There was also a Barong, that I haven't gotten around to formatting the pictures to post on here. That is in the best condition of the lot, and has a description carved into the sheath that suggests a GI bring-back item. Still, it has friction tape around the grip down by the blade where a wire wrap would traditionally have been. Might not be worth posting here as there are countless other examples already populating these pages.

-Rob

shayde78 · 23rd February 2021, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajen

Hello Shayde,

I hope that you take my comment not harshly!
It's now the second item you post here that is in my humble opinion not a collectors item and only a rusted piece of iron and not worth to spend any work of conservation in it. You should spend your money for better remained items.

Regards,
Detlef

Detlef,

I always appreciate honest opinions and sharing of expertise. It is the reason I am a member of this site - not to have my hopes confirmed, but to learn more about the items I collect. Thank you for being kind in the delivery of your feedback, but no worries, I fully accept the condition of this and the kukri are indeed rough, to say the least.

-Rob

22nd February 2021, 08:00 PM	#1
shayde78 Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 443	Poor condition Kindjal I'd like to get your comments on the Kindjal pictured below. This was part of a lot that I recently won. The condition of the items is not great (you may have seen the 'soussan patah-like' tulwar and the kukri in earlier posts). Anyway, here we have what I believe is best termed a Kindjal. Its condition suggests some legitimate age, but per feedback on the kurkri thread, poor storage conditions can make an item achieve the look of a relic in an accelerated timeline. The lack of adornment and the rivets appearing to have hand forged heads suggests something from the early 20th century, and something intended for use, rather than mere decoration. The wood is deteriorated - from age or poor storage conditions? Of course, I'm been victim to wishful thinking of late, so I am willing to concede this was made last spring, and aged quickly due to the pandemic, as I know I have! Specs: Overall length - 21.4" Blade length - 16.5" Blade width - 2 7/16" (just in front of hilt) Blade thickness - 5mm (tang as visible between handle slabs) Weight - 13.75 oz As always, thank you for your comments. Attached Images

23rd February 2021, 09:10 AM	#3
Kmaddock Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Ireland Posts: 532	Hi Shayde, In the job lot of items you got a fantastic, in my mind Sossun Pattah, you have up on another post. So if the other items are corroded beyond normal collector value (like this Item) so be it. I find I learn as much from relic items as much as good condition items was there much else in the haul? Regards, Ken Last edited by Kmaddock; 23rd February 2021 at 03:13 PM.

23rd February 2021, 08:17 AM	#2
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,467	Hello Shayde, I hope that you take my comment not harshly! It's now the second item you post here that is in my humble opinion not a collectors item and only a rusted piece of iron and not worth to spend any work of conservation in it. You should spend your money for better remained items. Regards, Detlef

23rd February 2021, 10:45 AM	#4
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,467	In the case that the sword was together with the two corroded items and the price was correct it was indeed no mistake!

23rd February 2021, 04:12 PM	#5
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,174	I think your assessment of the early 20th-century is correct and are you sure that the handle is wood rather than horn? Since the item is in poor condition, why not practice your restoration on it, where you can experiment with some techniques that you might not normally use?