Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > European Armoury
User Name
Password
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 19th June 2019, 07:04 AM   #1
kronckew
Member
 
kronckew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: CSA Consulate, Rm. 101, Glos. UK: p.s. - Real Dogs Have Feathering.
Posts: 3,027
Default Yet another wotsit.

Found this item at a local antiques dealer. He had no idea what it was. Other than it's obviously a well made and well balanced weapon I also have no idea who made it, what it's designed for, when it was made, or where. The sword is 34.5 in. long overall. The blade edges are only sharp in the tip section if front of the thick diamond x-section, and is in part blued. Looks like it once the whole blade was blued.

As a wild guess it looks like a cross between a sword breaker, a rapier, and a very long parrying dagger/sword catcher, and the guard looks vaguely oriental to me. The brass spiral grip looks like a European briquette sword. It was obvious made this way deliberately as a whole and not a marriage of spare parts. There may be a makers mark hidden under one of the short 'languettes' which I can't make out, might be easier after I clean it up a bit.

ny info anyone can supply will be appreciated, and thanks in advance...
Attached Images
      

Last edited by kronckew : 19th June 2019 at 07:37 AM.
kronckew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th June 2019, 07:24 AM   #2
Victrix
Member
 
Victrix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Sweden
Posts: 305
Default

It looks like a more recent/modern version of an estoc/panzerstecker? I never saw one with a brass grip before and they are typically longer. I posted pictures of my antique one here in post #15 http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showt...highlight=estoc. The style of the cross guard is similar shape but yours is cruder. This type of cross guard was popular in E.Europe in 17thC.
Victrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th June 2019, 07:35 AM   #3
kronckew
Member
 
kronckew's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: CSA Consulate, Rm. 101, Glos. UK: p.s. - Real Dogs Have Feathering.
Posts: 3,027
Default

Thanks again for that.

European troops wore armour well into the 19c (and still do for ceremonial occasions), mine would be handy for thrusting into the unprotected bits of a curassier, or a 17c turk in mail. the brass grip was cast to fit this weapon, balances it nicely, and the length would suit an infantry officer more than a cavalryman i suspect. Looks simpler than the estocs in the ref. post above, but couple have similar more finished guards. Mine looks more like a ;munitions' grade, well made but not for a high ranking (and rich) noble.

I note in the 'estoc' wikipedia entry they mention them being simply hung on the owner's horse harness, the front of the guard would facilitate that or being used as a belt hook. It also notes that infantry would also carry them, also for penetrating mail and i would assume a shorter version like mine. It mentions the portion nehind the tip being unsharpened and their use two handed with the off hand in front of the guard, which could be done with mine to better guide it in for a coup de grâce.

Infantry Estoc/koncerz a possibility then...

Last edited by kronckew : 19th June 2019 at 08:01 AM.
kronckew is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th June 2019, 08:58 AM   #4
Victrix
Member
 
Victrix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Sweden
Posts: 305
Default

Yours doesn’t look very Hungarian (e.g. grip, pommel) so I wouldn’t rule out Indian origins although my knowledge of the latter is very limited. That kind of brass grip looks quite early 19thC to me.
Victrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th June 2019, 10:23 AM   #5
Kmaddock
Member
 
Kmaddock's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Ireland
Posts: 295
Default

Hi
A wild guess with nothing to substantiate it would be a sword for bull fighting?
Interesting item and the brass handle does look to have some good age to it
regards
Ken
Kmaddock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 19th June 2019, 01:50 PM   #6
M ELEY
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NC, U.S.A.
Posts: 1,589
Default

Perhaps the handle is a more modern replacement? The cross guard and blade seem to show honest aging. A nice piece, but also a puzzle-
M ELEY is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 09:09 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin Version 3.0.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.