antique whip dagger - spanish?

Valjhun · 11th February 2006, 03:22 PM

ebay number 7216872116

What do you think about that? Age, origin?

According tom Mr. Tirri, whom expensive book i've bought recently it is a spanish dagger

. Take a look toi the page 27. It says: "Spanish influence and trade in southern Morocco, is further indicated by the Spanish dagger impored into Morocco."

Can you agree with him?

Well, I know perfectly wht it is, but I'll tell you later. Firstly I need to know your thoughts

wolviex · 11th February 2006, 03:48 PM

I don't know anything about knives like this, but are all with such blades like that on ebay?
I'm asking about it because this looks just like djerid from Polish buzdygan-mace. There is even screw just like in Polish ones to fasten it into the mace

ham · 11th February 2006, 04:49 PM

Gentlemen,

Whips like this one have been produced in Morocco for the tourist trade since the 1960s, perhaps earlier. I haven't seen any examples which were actually produced for use among local peoples.

Ham

Battara · 11th February 2006, 07:52 PM

Whip daggers were also produced by the Luzon and Visaya Filipinos, possibly influenced by the Spanish.

Marc · 11th February 2006, 09:24 PM

Well, not that, as far as I can tell, the Spaniards had any particular tendency towards putting spikes into whip's handles...

Valjhun · 12th February 2006, 05:57 PM

Well, Ham you are completely right saying that is not intended for use by local people. It is a complete tourist piece from the 60'-70', made in syria. It has a verry typical syrian manufactur regarding thoose insertions. My uncle brought back a dozen of thoose from Lebanon at that time as souvenir. Well, another pearl in mr. Tirris book, I guess.

wolviex · 12th February 2006, 06:25 PM

Hey, modern or not, I'm still curious about this blade which remind of and looks like jerides. What about others - are those the same?

Valjhun · 12th February 2006, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolviex

Hey, modern or not, I'm still curious about this blade which remind of and looks like jerides. What about others - are those the same?

Hmm... as far I can recall yes, they're pretty the same. I will go for a trip to my uncle the next month (he lives quite far away) to take some photos. I recall that one of them, beside the same screw it had a twisted spiral like "blade", mor like a spike. I recall also a lot of similarity in indian and persian axes, bhujs and maces with similar attachments.

In the meanwhile, could you please post a pic of such a polish mace?

Valjhun · 5th March 2006, 07:25 PM

I haven't had time to visit mny uncle, but I've mentioned the debate to him and he sent me one of thoose. Quite similar, and it isn't even leather that is artificial...

Dom · 6th March 2006, 01:14 AM

whip called, camel drivers whip, masses Moroccan production for tourists, when I was in Morocco in years 60/65, this type of article was a must as "souvenir"

at least is funny

ariel · 6th March 2006, 01:39 AM

The use of weapons with hidden blades is pretty popular around the world. Here is my Fakir's Crutch, fully original. Can be used as a mace (handle and base have thickened rectangular endings) or as a stiletto. Of course, by the time this poor, handicapped Indian mendicant was able to unscrew the blade, he was supposed to be long dead. On the other hand, he might not have been THAT BADLY handicapped...

11th February 2006, 03:22 PM	#1
Valjhun Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 692	antique whip dagger - spanish? ebay number 7216872116 What do you think about that? Age, origin? According tom Mr. Tirri, whom expensive book i've bought recently it is a spanish dagger . Take a look toi the page 27. It says: "Spanish influence and trade in southern Morocco, is further indicated by the Spanish dagger impored into Morocco." Can you agree with him? Well, I know perfectly wht it is, but I'll tell you later. Firstly I need to know your thoughts

5th March 2006, 07:25 PM	#9
Valjhun Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 692	I haven't had time to visit mny uncle, but I've mentioned the debate to him and he sent me one of thoose. Quite similar, and it isn't even leather that is artificial... Attached Images

6th March 2006, 01:39 AM	#11
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	The use of weapons with hidden blades is pretty popular around the world. Here is my Fakir's Crutch, fully original. Can be used as a mace (handle and base have thickened rectangular endings) or as a stiletto. Of course, by the time this poor, handicapped Indian mendicant was able to unscrew the blade, he was supposed to be long dead. On the other hand, he might not have been THAT BADLY handicapped... Attached Images

11th February 2006, 03:48 PM	#2
wolviex Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poland, Krakow Posts: 418	I don't know anything about knives like this, but are all with such blades like that on ebay? I'm asking about it because this looks just like djerid from Polish buzdygan-mace. There is even screw just like in Polish ones to fasten it into the mace

11th February 2006, 04:49 PM	#3
ham Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 190	Gentlemen, Whips like this one have been produced in Morocco for the tourist trade since the 1960s, perhaps earlier. I haven't seen any examples which were actually produced for use among local peoples. Ham

11th February 2006, 07:52 PM	#4
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Whip daggers were also produced by the Luzon and Visaya Filipinos, possibly influenced by the Spanish.

11th February 2006, 09:24 PM	#5
Marc Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Madrid / Barcelona Posts: 256	Well, not that, as far as I can tell, the Spaniards had any particular tendency towards putting spikes into whip's handles...

12th February 2006, 05:57 PM	#6
Valjhun Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 692	Well, Ham you are completely right saying that is not intended for use by local people. It is a complete tourist piece from the 60'-70', made in syria. It has a verry typical syrian manufactur regarding thoose insertions. My uncle brought back a dozen of thoose from Lebanon at that time as souvenir. Well, another pearl in mr. Tirris book, I guess.

12th February 2006, 06:25 PM	#7
wolviex Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Poland, Krakow Posts: 418	Hey, modern or not, I'm still curious about this blade which remind of and looks like jerides. What about others - are those the same?

6th March 2006, 01:14 AM	#10
Dom Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Paris (FR*) Cairo (EG) Posts: 1,142	whip called, camel drivers whip, masses Moroccan production for tourists, when I was in Morocco in years 60/65, this type of article was a must as "souvenir" at least is funny