Keris Sepang

David · 30th September 2012, 06:08 AM

I couldn't resist placing an bid on this keris sepang and won it for the opening bid. No sheath and the quality is nothing too great, but these seem to be a fairly rare dhapur and it seemed worth picking up for the price. I'd be real happy if the hilt turn out to be horn, though i think i see a chipped piece that reveals it as wood.
Feel free to comment, but i would really love to here impressions on the form itself. What ideas do people have on keris sepang?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-Kri...vip=true&rt=nc

Henk · 30th September 2012, 09:11 AM

Could be a keris sepang, but i have some doubts because of the ganja. It should be equal to both sides and it doesn't fit very well. Could be the age,but...
Nice ukiran for sure. I also do believe it is a wooden one.

David · 30th September 2012, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Henk

Could be a keris sepang, but i have some doubts because of the ganja. It should be equal to both sides and it doesn't fit very well. Could be the age,but...
Nice ukiran for sure. I also do believe it is a wooden one.

Henk, i am pretty sure the gonjo fit has to do with age. As for the equality issue, i have seen all kinds os variations on the degree of equality. If not a keris sepang, what would you call it?

Atlantia · 1st October 2012, 01:33 AM

Beauty! Seems very cheap for a nice Keris! Well done mate!

Sajen · 1st October 2012, 01:33 PM

Hello David,

good buy indeed, only the handle is worth the given price. Hope you will post better pictures when you have received the keris. Have seen it as well but was unsure about the blade and still have enough restauration projects.

Here a other sepang blade which was shown from Semar: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=sepang

Regards,

Detlef

David · 1st October 2012, 02:30 PM

Thanks for the link Detlef. I also have another, much nicer keris sepang in my collection. Again, there is no doubt in my mind that this blade is mediocre at best in terms of quality, but it was not really my intention with this thread to gather comments on that. I do still think the blade is also well worth the price simply due to it's rarity. We just don't see that many old sepangs. What i was really hoping this thread would become is a discussion on the sepang form in general. I would love to hear people's impressions on this dhapur, including what folks think about it's possible "purpose". I read somewhere that it is considered a good dhapur for securing a good marriage. If that is true you would think that we would see it more often...

David · 6th October 2012, 11:14 PM

hmmm...i was hoping to raise more interest in this thread because i would really like to hear more opinions on the keris sepang form. Anyone have any examples they might like to post?
In the interest of re-sparking the conversation here are some shot of this one i just received. I spruced it up as best i could, but it seems obvious that it will need the full treatment to eliminate remaining rust.
I think it is clear in these photos that this is the original gonjo. The iron and pamor are identical. I am also intrigued by a line of brighter high contrast pamor that appears along the edge when the blade is held at an angle. It isn't easy to photograph, but i think you will be able to see what i mean in at least one of these photos.

So, any thoughts on the sepang dhapur in general or this keris in particular?

A. G. Maisey · 7th October 2012, 01:05 AM

Looks a better quality piece in these shots.

If this keris were mine, I probably would not restain it, its acceptable as it is in my book. I'd certainly WD40 it, good long soak and then carefully work over it to remove as much of that surface rust as possible. Good scrub with a stiff brush and hot soapy water to start with. You can get into the grooves and hollows with fine steel wool wrapped around a sate stick --- bambu skewer.

I do not believe in cleaning and restaining a blade simply because it is slightly less than immaculate, the less you can clean a keris the better off you are. Even when a blade is heavily rusted its possibly not a good idea to try to get it 100% perfect with the first clean. I'll usually come back to a very badly rusted blade several times over several years, especially so if it is a quality blade.

David · 7th October 2012, 03:16 AM

Thanks Alan...yes, i also think it turned out to be a somewhat better keris than the auction photos showed. I agree about not restaining if i can get rid of the existing rust residue without removing much of the existing stain. As i stated, i only gave this a quick sprucing up to get a better idea of what i had bought and get some pictures done. It only had a fairly quick working over with WD-40 a toothbrush and then some fine steel wool.
Do you have any thoughts on that line of brighter pamor. Only shows super bright at about a 45º angle. You can see it best in photo #3.

A. G. Maisey · 7th October 2012, 11:37 AM

I'm not at all sure of what I can see David, but whatever did cause this uneven distribution of contrasting material it was simply some sort of lack of control in process.

kai · 7th October 2012, 02:27 PM

Hello David & Alan,

from the pics, it looks like a grinding mark to me?

Regards,
Kai

David · 7th October 2012, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

Hello David & Alan,

from the pics, it looks like a grinding mark to me?

Regards,
Kai

I thought that at first as well Kai, and that just might be, but it reacts really differently from the rest of the pamor and seems to be of a higher contrast material than the rest. As Alan points out, it does seem rather uncontrolled...

David · 12th October 2012, 07:11 PM

Well, i'm going to give this one more try before putting it to rest. ANY more info or examples of keris sepang out there?

I have checked our archives, of course, and seen a few more examples, but there is little real info to go along with them. The books i own don't seem to shed too much more light on the subject either. I am interested in approximately when this form may have emerged and what significance it might have held (since it is a departure from the norm for keris dhapur). Anybody?

Naga Sasra · 14th October 2012, 03:40 AM

Okay David, I will attemps to be the "anybody" here

Attached five pieces from various area's that with one exception would qualify as the dapur Sepang

Jean · 14th October 2012, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naga Sasra

Okay David, I will attemps to be the "anybody" here

Attached five pieces from various area's that with one exception would qualify as the dapur Sepang

Hello Naga Sasra,
According to the EK (but not the book Dhapur), the kris shown on your first and last pictures has a dapur Regol (with twin gandik). I attach the pictures of a similar kris from my collection, and of my only kris with dapur Sepang.
David, sorry I have no information about the origin of this dapur, I consider it as just a variant symmetrical dapur like dapur Regol or Karna Tinanding. There is another variation of dapur Sepang with a gandik as indicated in the EK and shown in the book Dhapur.

Regards

David · 14th October 2012, 04:06 PM

Thanks guys. It's nice to see other examples even if we can't find more information. Way too much knowledge about keris obscured by time...

ferrylaki · 13th November 2012, 04:26 AM

one of the most rare "dhapur" is sepang

30th September 2012, 06:08 AM	#1
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,023	Keris Sepang I couldn't resist placing an bid on this keris sepang and won it for the opening bid. No sheath and the quality is nothing too great, but these seem to be a fairly rare dhapur and it seemed worth picking up for the price. I'd be real happy if the hilt turn out to be horn, though i think i see a chipped piece that reveals it as wood. Feel free to comment, but i would really love to here impressions on the form itself. What ideas do people have on keris sepang? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-Kri...vip=true&rt=nc

6th October 2012, 11:14 PM	#7
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,023	hmmm...i was hoping to raise more interest in this thread because i would really like to hear more opinions on the keris sepang form. Anyone have any examples they might like to post? In the interest of re-sparking the conversation here are some shot of this one i just received. I spruced it up as best i could, but it seems obvious that it will need the full treatment to eliminate remaining rust. I think it is clear in these photos that this is the original gonjo. The iron and pamor are identical. I am also intrigued by a line of brighter high contrast pamor that appears along the edge when the blade is held at an angle. It isn't easy to photograph, but i think you will be able to see what i mean in at least one of these photos. So, any thoughts on the sepang dhapur in general or this keris in particular? Attached Images

14th October 2012, 03:40 AM	#14
Naga Sasra Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Boca Raton, Florida, USA Posts: 108	Okay David, I will attemps to be the "anybody" here Attached five pieces from various area's that with one exception would qualify as the dapur Sepang Attached Images

30th September 2012, 09:11 AM	#2
Henk Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,209	Could be a keris sepang, but i have some doubts because of the ganja. It should be equal to both sides and it doesn't fit very well. Could be the age,but... Nice ukiran for sure. I also do believe it is a wooden one.

1st October 2012, 01:33 AM	#4
Atlantia Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Sharp end Posts: 2,928	Beauty! Seems very cheap for a nice Keris! Well done mate!

1st October 2012, 01:33 PM	#5
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 8,468	Hello David, good buy indeed, only the handle is worth the given price. Hope you will post better pictures when you have received the keris. Have seen it as well but was unsure about the blade and still have enough restauration projects. Here a other sepang blade which was shown from Semar: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=sepang Regards, Detlef

1st October 2012, 02:30 PM	#6
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,023	Thanks for the link Detlef. I also have another, much nicer keris sepang in my collection. Again, there is no doubt in my mind that this blade is mediocre at best in terms of quality, but it was not really my intention with this thread to gather comments on that. I do still think the blade is also well worth the price simply due to it's rarity. We just don't see that many old sepangs. What i was really hoping this thread would become is a discussion on the sepang form in general. I would love to hear people's impressions on this dhapur, including what folks think about it's possible "purpose". I read somewhere that it is considered a good dhapur for securing a good marriage. If that is true you would think that we would see it more often...

7th October 2012, 01:05 AM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	Looks a better quality piece in these shots. If this keris were mine, I probably would not restain it, its acceptable as it is in my book. I'd certainly WD40 it, good long soak and then carefully work over it to remove as much of that surface rust as possible. Good scrub with a stiff brush and hot soapy water to start with. You can get into the grooves and hollows with fine steel wool wrapped around a sate stick --- bambu skewer. I do not believe in cleaning and restaining a blade simply because it is slightly less than immaculate, the less you can clean a keris the better off you are. Even when a blade is heavily rusted its possibly not a good idea to try to get it 100% perfect with the first clean. I'll usually come back to a very badly rusted blade several times over several years, especially so if it is a quality blade.

7th October 2012, 03:16 AM	#9
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,023	Thanks Alan...yes, i also think it turned out to be a somewhat better keris than the auction photos showed. I agree about not restaining if i can get rid of the existing rust residue without removing much of the existing stain. As i stated, i only gave this a quick sprucing up to get a better idea of what i had bought and get some pictures done. It only had a fairly quick working over with WD-40 a toothbrush and then some fine steel wool. Do you have any thoughts on that line of brighter pamor. Only shows super bright at about a 45º angle. You can see it best in photo #3.

7th October 2012, 11:37 AM	#10
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,697	I'm not at all sure of what I can see David, but whatever did cause this uneven distribution of contrasting material it was simply some sort of lack of control in process.

7th October 2012, 02:27 PM	#11
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,215	Hello David & Alan, from the pics, it looks like a grinding mark to me? Regards, Kai

12th October 2012, 07:11 PM	#13
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,023	Well, i'm going to give this one more try before putting it to rest. ANY more info or examples of keris sepang out there? I have checked our archives, of course, and seen a few more examples, but there is little real info to go along with them. The books i own don't seem to shed too much more light on the subject either. I am interested in approximately when this form may have emerged and what significance it might have held (since it is a departure from the norm for keris dhapur). Anybody?

14th October 2012, 04:06 PM	#16
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,023	Thanks guys. It's nice to see other examples even if we can't find more information. Way too much knowledge about keris obscured by time...

13th November 2012, 04:26 AM	#17
ferrylaki Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 285	one of the most rare "dhapur" is sepang