African axe

ggoudie · 5th January 2006, 02:13 PM

Can anyone help me with this axe? It is a two-handed monster which is 43 inches long, with a 12 inch blade and stamped on the tang with the number 23. Does anyone know anything about axes like this - origin, history etc? I would be grateful for any info.
Please see attached photo.
Cheers
Graeme

Lew · 5th January 2006, 05:28 PM

Hi ggoudie

Your axe looks to be Shona to me and it's a nice old example.

Lew

Oriental-Arms · 5th January 2006, 07:56 PM

Shona it is. Nice example, probably early 20 C. Not a very efficient weapon and mostly used as a simbol of status.
The Shona is the largest ethnic group in Zimbabwe, more than 70% of the population. They are known for their artisitic skills in pottery, copper, brass and iron crafts.

Tim Simmons · 5th January 2006, 08:23 PM

I beg to differ as to whether this is an effective weapon or not. Compered to cultures rich in technology and iron and steel it does look a little flimsy. If you imagine your traditional enemies have the same standard of weapons then effective, is relative. If you are fighting just short of naked, a blow from an axe like this would be unpleasant. It may appear lightweight but the warrior might have to run to battle and then fight for a hour or so, you try that with a wood chopping axe. As I have said before a swing at your head could take half your face off easily. Tim. PS, all you wood cutters out there might think you are hard, you do not have to move when chopping logs because they do not fight back!!!!

Oriental-Arms · 5th January 2006, 09:18 PM

If you compare it to a good Songye axe (which I personally consider as masterpieces of African axes):

Or to a good Chokwe axe

you can easily see what I mean by not very efficient. No offense to the Shona axes I hope. I liked them a lot

Tim Simmons · 6th January 2006, 11:45 AM

I like Congo axes very much, I have still to get one. I agree that many axes from southern Africa are made from small and often quite lightweight pieces of metal which I think makes them all the more thought out and economically effective weapons. Is that Chokwe axe a large weapon or a small dance axe? I have seen some very heavy ones, well over my budget

. Tim

Oriental-Arms · 6th January 2006, 03:17 PM

The blade is 2 X 4 inches and the haft is 14 inches. Rather short but with a heavy blade. The effective blade and simple decoration suggests a real fighting weapon. For more details on this axe see Fighting Axe of the Chokwe

Tim Simmons · 6th January 2006, 05:07 PM

Lightweight but all that is needed, I have shown this before but who cares. The haft is only 49cm long so it would be used at close range. The blade is 19cm long in total, the edge is 13cm across and could deliver quite a slash as well as chopping. The blade is quite heavy for its size with a sort of midrib. A light one handed weapon. I just like talking African axes

. Tim

Freddy · 6th January 2006, 05:54 PM

You could both be right.
A light axe can also do a lot of damage. I don't think that medieval European battle axes were that heavy when used on foot.

And a ceremonial axe, can be quite heavy, too. Look at this Songye axe. It weighs about 2 kgs.

I also want to show a small battle axe. I think it's from South Africa, but I'm not sure which tribe it comes from. It has a very slender shaft and a small axe blade which is pretty sharp. The shape of the shaft make it ideal for hacking.
The other weapon is sort of a pick axe. It originates from Western Africa, that's all I know.

Lenght of small axe : 46,5 cm, axe blade : 7,5 cm, cutting edge : 4,7 cm.

Length of pick axe : 48 cm, axe blade : 25,5 cm (with serrated edge near the point).

Andrew · 6th January 2006, 07:27 PM

Freddy, your axe looks very much like the Chokwe example shown by Artzi.

That pick is fearsome-looking!

Tim Simmons · 6th January 2006, 08:35 PM

That pick axe is great! I have shown this before also. Another example of how a small expensive piece of metal is turned into a deadly weapon. The blade is quite light compered to the other axe I post on this thread, a good deal thinner. 10.5 cm across the edge and protruding 13.5cm but with a long reach, with a haft 84cm long, so this weapon could be used with one or both hands at arms length or at close quarters held in the middle using both ends to strike with. Thats what you call effective for a very small piece of metal. Tim.

Freddy · 7th January 2006, 05:27 PM

Here's another one with a peculiar blade. It comes from the Dogon tribe in Mali. The cutting edge is at the upper side of the blade.

Total length : 63,5 cm. Length of blade : 22 cm.

Tim Simmons · 7th January 2006, 07:45 PM

Fantastic! really scary close contact weapon made again from a small piece of metal. With this you have a combination of club, stabbing and a slashing ability all you need is the aggressive frenzy

. Tim

5th January 2006, 02:13 PM	#1
ggoudie Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 29	African axe Can anyone help me with this axe? It is a two-handed monster which is 43 inches long, with a 12 inch blade and stamped on the tang with the number 23. Does anyone know anything about axes like this - origin, history etc? I would be grateful for any info. Please see attached photo. Cheers Graeme Attached Images

5th January 2006, 07:56 PM	#3
Oriental-Arms Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Haifa, Israel Posts: 183	Shona Axe Shona it is. Nice example, probably early 20 C. Not a very efficient weapon and mostly used as a simbol of status. The Shona is the largest ethnic group in Zimbabwe, more than 70% of the population. They are known for their artisitic skills in pottery, copper, brass and iron crafts.

5th January 2006, 08:23 PM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	I beg to differ as to whether this is an effective weapon or not. Compered to cultures rich in technology and iron and steel it does look a little flimsy. If you imagine your traditional enemies have the same standard of weapons then effective, is relative. If you are fighting just short of naked, a blow from an axe like this would be unpleasant. It may appear lightweight but the warrior might have to run to battle and then fight for a hour or so, you try that with a wood chopping axe. As I have said before a swing at your head could take half your face off easily. Tim. PS, all you wood cutters out there might think you are hard, you do not have to move when chopping logs because they do not fight back!!!! Last edited by Tim Simmons; 5th January 2006 at 08:55 PM. Reason: chop chop

5th January 2006, 09:18 PM	#5
Oriental-Arms Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Haifa, Israel Posts: 183	African axes If you compare it to a good Songye axe (which I personally consider as masterpieces of African axes): Or to a good Chokwe axe you can easily see what I mean by not very efficient. No offense to the Shona axes I hope. I liked them a lot

6th January 2006, 03:17 PM	#7
Oriental-Arms Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Haifa, Israel Posts: 183	Chokwe Axe The blade is 2 X 4 inches and the haft is 14 inches. Rather short but with a heavy blade. The effective blade and simple decoration suggests a real fighting weapon. For more details on this axe see Fighting Axe of the Chokwe

5th January 2006, 05:28 PM	#2
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Hi ggoudie Your axe looks to be Shona to me and it's a nice old example. Lew

6th January 2006, 11:45 AM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	I like Congo axes very much, I have still to get one. I agree that many axes from southern Africa are made from small and often quite lightweight pieces of metal which I think makes them all the more thought out and economically effective weapons. Is that Chokwe axe a large weapon or a small dance axe? I have seen some very heavy ones, well over my budget . Tim

6th January 2006, 05:07 PM	#8
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Just cannot stop Lightweight but all that is needed, I have shown this before but who cares. The haft is only 49cm long so it would be used at close range. The blade is 19cm long in total, the edge is 13cm across and could deliver quite a slash as well as chopping. The blade is quite heavy for its size with a sort of midrib. A light one handed weapon. I just like talking African axes . Tim Attached Images

6th January 2006, 05:54 PM	#9
Freddy Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sint-Amandsberg (near Ghent, Belgium) Posts: 830	Let's join ! You could both be right. A light axe can also do a lot of damage. I don't think that medieval European battle axes were that heavy when used on foot. And a ceremonial axe, can be quite heavy, too. Look at this Songye axe. It weighs about 2 kgs. I also want to show a small battle axe. I think it's from South Africa, but I'm not sure which tribe it comes from. It has a very slender shaft and a small axe blade which is pretty sharp. The shape of the shaft make it ideal for hacking. The other weapon is sort of a pick axe. It originates from Western Africa, that's all I know. Lenght of small axe : 46,5 cm, axe blade : 7,5 cm, cutting edge : 4,7 cm. Length of pick axe : 48 cm, axe blade : 25,5 cm (with serrated edge near the point).

6th January 2006, 07:27 PM	#10
Andrew Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,725	Freddy, your axe looks very much like the Chokwe example shown by Artzi. That pick is fearsome-looking!

6th January 2006, 08:35 PM	#11
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	That pick axe is great! I have shown this before also. Another example of how a small expensive piece of metal is turned into a deadly weapon. The blade is quite light compered to the other axe I post on this thread, a good deal thinner. 10.5 cm across the edge and protruding 13.5cm but with a long reach, with a haft 84cm long, so this weapon could be used with one or both hands at arms length or at close quarters held in the middle using both ends to strike with. Thats what you call effective for a very small piece of metal. Tim. Attached Images

7th January 2006, 05:27 PM	#12
Freddy Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sint-Amandsberg (near Ghent, Belgium) Posts: 830	Here's another one with a peculiar blade. It comes from the Dogon tribe in Mali. The cutting edge is at the upper side of the blade. Total length : 63,5 cm. Length of blade : 22 cm.

7th January 2006, 07:45 PM	#13
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,739	Fantastic! really scary close contact weapon made again from a small piece of metal. With this you have a combination of club, stabbing and a slashing ability all you need is the aggressive frenzy . Tim