The Dresden MONK'S GUN - a MYTH Revisited, and Finally CORRECTLY DATED: ca. 1525-30!

Spiridonov · 7th December 2016, 03:37 PM

Has anyone seen another photo of monk's gun? For example bottom view photo. Who knows how the lock was attached? Soldering or screws?

Spiridonov · 8th October 2017, 09:36 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_cDCcH05Kk
The monk's gun was found by an amateur archeologist

fernando · 9th October 2017, 06:27 PM

Well, Alexander; do you think this movie was really shot while the finding took place, or a simulation of what must have happened ?

Spiridonov · 9th October 2017, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fernando

Well, Alexander; do you think this movie was really shot while the finding took place, or a simulation of what must have happened ?

Possibly simulation/ I don't know exactly

Raf · 16th October 2017, 06:47 PM

Just in case the link vanishes here are a few stills to complete the thread.

Marcus den toom · 17th October 2017, 11:42 AM

Sorry to burst the bubble, but this person makes forgeries for ebay.

He sells haquebuts poleguns etc as well.
The fact that this piece is:
-so well preserved after a odd 500 years
-only 10 cm in to the earth with "fresh" leaves covering the piece
-the fact he knows what this is for an "amateur"
-the real Monk's gun is just a curio, not a standard firearm of the time and finding another one in the earth like this is more than curious.....

Still a fun display and interesting if it where in "new" condition.

fernando · 17th October 2017, 12:02 PM

No fun for me; an hoax is always an hoax, no matter the context.
Many people may (are) deceived with this crap.
... Even Alexander, for one, has hesitated.

Flaregun · 3rd January 2021, 05:12 PM

Hello together,
my name is Claus and I joined this forum just to dig out this old thread.
I'm fascinated by this gun since I first saw it in Dresden about 20 years ago. Now I got the time to built a copy to answer the question about the possibility of using it. My first trials were disappointing - as mentioned in the thread the rasp ignition didn't work. I will improve the rasp next days and try again...
So I would like to know if anybody of you got new informations or understanding about this interesting part of gun-history? I have a fear that the Dresden monks gun is an attempt that never was in service due to several other problems as holding the ignition powder in the pan when attached to the belt. I'm curious about your opinions,
greetings from south-west Germany,
Claus

Raf · 11th January 2021, 03:00 PM

My conclusion is that the Monks gun was a generic term referring to an early rasp operated ignition system associated by tradition with the monk Berthold Schwartz . Of which the Dresden gun is a late and probably non functional example . Thierbach ( Die geschiliche Entwickelung der Handfeurwaffen - Dresden 1886-7) illustrates two other examples , one a brass cannon lock manually operated in the Zeunghaus , Berlin and a gun lock in Sigmaringen Museum actuated by a spiral spring. If anyone has a copy of this book or knows these examples it would be good to see illustrations.

16th October 2017, 06:47 PM	#5
Raf Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 238	A myth revisited ? Just in case the link vanishes here are a few stills to complete the thread. Attached Images

3rd January 2021, 05:12 PM	#8
Flaregun Member Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: South-West Germany Posts: 1	Hello together, my name is Claus and I joined this forum just to dig out this old thread. I'm fascinated by this gun since I first saw it in Dresden about 20 years ago. Now I got the time to built a copy to answer the question about the possibility of using it. My first trials were disappointing - as mentioned in the thread the rasp ignition didn't work. I will improve the rasp next days and try again... So I would like to know if anybody of you got new informations or understanding about this interesting part of gun-history? I have a fear that the Dresden monks gun is an attempt that never was in service due to several other problems as holding the ignition powder in the pan when attached to the belt. I'm curious about your opinions, greetings from south-west Germany, Claus Attached Images

7th December 2016, 03:37 PM	#1
Spiridonov Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Russia, Leningrad Posts: 355	Has anyone seen another photo of monk's gun? For example bottom view photo. Who knows how the lock was attached? Soldering or screws?

8th October 2017, 09:36 PM	#2
Spiridonov Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Russia, Leningrad Posts: 355	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_cDCcH05Kk The monk's gun was found by an amateur archeologist

9th October 2017, 06:27 PM	#3
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,649	Well, Alexander; do you think this movie was really shot while the finding took place, or a simulation of what must have happened ?

17th October 2017, 11:42 AM	#6
Marcus den toom Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Netherlands Posts: 494	Sorry to burst the bubble, but this person makes forgeries for ebay. He sells haquebuts poleguns etc as well. The fact that this piece is: -so well preserved after a odd 500 years -only 10 cm in to the earth with "fresh" leaves covering the piece -the fact he knows what this is for an "amateur" -the real Monk's gun is just a curio, not a standard firearm of the time and finding another one in the earth like this is more than curious..... Still a fun display and interesting if it where in "new" condition.

17th October 2017, 12:02 PM	#7
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,649	No fun for me; an hoax is always an hoax, no matter the context. Many people may (are) deceived with this crap. ... Even Alexander, for one, has hesitated.

11th January 2021, 03:00 PM	#9
Raf Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 238	My conclusion is that the Monks gun was a generic term referring to an early rasp operated ignition system associated by tradition with the monk Berthold Schwartz . Of which the Dresden gun is a late and probably non functional example . Thierbach ( Die geschiliche Entwickelung der Handfeurwaffen - Dresden 1886-7) illustrates two other examples , one a brass cannon lock manually operated in the Zeunghaus , Berlin and a gun lock in Sigmaringen Museum actuated by a spiral spring. If anyone has a copy of this book or knows these examples it would be good to see illustrations.