Interesting Takouba

stephen wood · 14th July 2010, 01:08 AM

Has anyone ever seen a Takouba with such a point? - they are usually rounded off.

The blade is long for a Takouba - 35 1/2". I think it is a "Southern" type and appears quite old...

Jim McDougall · 14th July 2010, 02:52 AM

This does seem like a southern type, and the brass coverings have been lost, and very timely post (see 'My Haladie' thread) as we are discussing the 'cross pollination' of kaskara and takouba in singular cases. As you have noted, the rounded tip is characteristic for takouba blades, very much in accord with Omani kattara type blades, which incidentally often seem to have strong association with these North African broadsword blades.
This unusually long blade with 'spear point' seems lilkely to be a blade of the form typically mounted in kaskara, however, as noted in the haladie thread, there is evidence that these blades moved westward with nomadic traffic or trade in apparantly limited number.

I received my newsletter from the Arms and Armour Society, and look forward to hearing more on your presentation on the kaskara, and wish you all the best. It is quite an honor to be addressing this most esteemed society, and I am probably not alone in wishing I could attend.

All best regards,
Jim

Iain · 14th July 2010, 10:36 AM

Hi Stephen,

That's a quite old 19th century takouba in the southern style. Two similar ones can be seen in the Museum of Natural History collections:

http://anthro.amnh.org/anthropology/...%20%20126%20AB

http://anthro.amnh.org/anthropology/...%20%20127%20AB

Both examples have a Nigerian attribution. Given the recent discussions Jim noted about the cross influences of kaskara and takouba in Hausa areas I would think it fairly safe to say yours could be from these northern Nigeria regions.

I would not assume that yours had brass plates, as you can see in one example I posted it appears that rivets hold the leather in place on the guard.

Can I ask if the sword is in your personal collection? I would look forward to seeing detailed shots of the fullers, half moons (I assume they are present?) etc if you could post such details.

Best,

Iain

stephen wood · 16th July 2010, 01:12 AM

...no, I don't have it yet but as far as I can see there are no markings on the blade.

Of interest - the Hausa word for "sword" is said to be "takobi" (singular) "takoba" (plural). The Nouba word for the same is "fareynga".

Many thanks for your encouragement.

Jim McDougall · 17th July 2010, 04:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen wood

...no, I don't have it yet but as far as I can see there are no markings on the blade.

Of interest - the Hausa word for "sword" is said to be "takobi" (singular) "takoba" (plural). The Nouba word for the same is "fareynga".

Many thanks for your encouragement.

Interesting to see that the term 'takouba' from the tamasheq language of the Tuareg is also in the Hausa language as noted. It seems the 'Kano' dialect is the most commonly used Hausa dialect and also used with Fulani....I dont believe the term takouba is used in Fulani, at least not from what I have learned from Fulani speakers.

Also interesting to see the term 'fareynga' for sword in the Nuba language, apparantly this term, seems remarkably close to the familiar 'firangi' which is known in western regions in India as referring to a 'foreign' blade. The term itself seems with Persian root that evolved into use in Arab and other languages, with that general meaning, and often applied to swords.

Terminology of weapons is always an adventure, and has been to topic of lots of discussions through the years. Im certainly no linguist, but have learned a lot from those who sometimes post here who are.

stephen wood · 17th July 2010, 11:55 AM

...yes, a foreign blade locally hilted.

This photo appears to show a "Southern" type Takouba but is not from the region one might expect and the two "Southern" types discussed here Etude de 2 Takouba are old and are also from Algeria.

Jim McDougall · 18th July 2010, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stephen wood

...yes, a foreign blade locally hilted.

This photo appears to show a "Southern" type Takouba but is not from the region one might expect and the two "Southern" types discussed here Etude de 2 Takouba are old and are also from Algeria.

Thank you for linking the excellent work of Louis-Pierre Cavaille!!!
He really did some outstanding research and well presented.

Iain · 21st July 2010, 08:32 AM

Yes, takouba are not unknown in Algeria. The range of Tuareg and other nomadic tribes stretched through these areas as well.

The globular pommels are indicative of early pieces (although other variations are documented from turn of the century at least).

The other two Algerian pieces you linked were posted first on one of the older incarnations of this forum if I remember correctly. With established dating of 1830 I consider them very important examples.

I am still quite interested to see more details of the takouba you posted when you have a chance to make additional photos.

All the best,

Iain

Iain · 7th September 2010, 10:45 AM

I wanted to revive this thread to ask Stephen if you received this sword? I'd still be interested to see better photos especially of any blade markings...

Best,

Iain

stephen wood · 8th September 2010, 01:17 PM

...it should arrive soon Iain - when it does I'll post more pictures.

14th July 2010, 01:08 AM	#1
stephen wood Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 227	Interesting Takouba Has anyone ever seen a Takouba with such a point? - they are usually rounded off. The blade is long for a Takouba - 35 1/2". I think it is a "Southern" type and appears quite old... Attached Images

17th July 2010, 11:55 AM	#6
stephen wood Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 227	...yes, a foreign blade locally hilted. This photo appears to show a "Southern" type Takouba but is not from the region one might expect and the two "Southern" types discussed here Etude de 2 Takouba are old and are also from Algeria. Attached Images Last edited by stephen wood; 17th July 2010 at 12:40 PM.

14th July 2010, 02:52 AM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,739	This does seem like a southern type, and the brass coverings have been lost, and very timely post (see 'My Haladie' thread) as we are discussing the 'cross pollination' of kaskara and takouba in singular cases. As you have noted, the rounded tip is characteristic for takouba blades, very much in accord with Omani kattara type blades, which incidentally often seem to have strong association with these North African broadsword blades. This unusually long blade with 'spear point' seems lilkely to be a blade of the form typically mounted in kaskara, however, as noted in the haladie thread, there is evidence that these blades moved westward with nomadic traffic or trade in apparantly limited number. I received my newsletter from the Arms and Armour Society, and look forward to hearing more on your presentation on the kaskara, and wish you all the best. It is quite an honor to be addressing this most esteemed society, and I am probably not alone in wishing I could attend. All best regards, Jim

14th July 2010, 10:36 AM	#3
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,680	Hi Stephen, That's a quite old 19th century takouba in the southern style. Two similar ones can be seen in the Museum of Natural History collections: http://anthro.amnh.org/anthropology/...%20%20126%20AB http://anthro.amnh.org/anthropology/...%20%20127%20AB Both examples have a Nigerian attribution. Given the recent discussions Jim noted about the cross influences of kaskara and takouba in Hausa areas I would think it fairly safe to say yours could be from these northern Nigeria regions. I would not assume that yours had brass plates, as you can see in one example I posted it appears that rivets hold the leather in place on the guard. Can I ask if the sword is in your personal collection? I would look forward to seeing detailed shots of the fullers, half moons (I assume they are present?) etc if you could post such details. Best, Iain

16th July 2010, 01:12 AM	#4
stephen wood Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 227	...no, I don't have it yet but as far as I can see there are no markings on the blade. Of interest - the Hausa word for "sword" is said to be "takobi" (singular) "takoba" (plural). The Nouba word for the same is "fareynga". Many thanks for your encouragement.

21st July 2010, 08:32 AM	#8
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,680	Yes, takouba are not unknown in Algeria. The range of Tuareg and other nomadic tribes stretched through these areas as well. The globular pommels are indicative of early pieces (although other variations are documented from turn of the century at least). The other two Algerian pieces you linked were posted first on one of the older incarnations of this forum if I remember correctly. With established dating of 1830 I consider them very important examples. I am still quite interested to see more details of the takouba you posted when you have a chance to make additional photos. All the best, Iain

7th September 2010, 10:45 AM	#9
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,680	I wanted to revive this thread to ask Stephen if you received this sword? I'd still be interested to see better photos especially of any blade markings... Best, Iain

8th September 2010, 01:17 PM	#10
stephen wood Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 227	...it should arrive soon Iain - when it does I'll post more pictures.