Never seen a keris like this

hoorn178 · 8th August 2007, 04:38 PM

Dear all,

Enclosed some pictures of a keris I have seen. I have seen simular flower motives on a antique silver Malay box. It is said that the South Philippine owner of the keris died in 1942 and that

it was sold after world war 2 and ended up in Europe. Can anyone tell more?.

Thanks in advance.

Best regards,

Bart.

David · 8th August 2007, 06:17 PM

That is beautiful metal work. I'm not so sure it is Malay though. The patterns look like okir to me. I think this is a Moro piece.

Do you own this kris now? Or have access to it. I would love to see more close-ups, especially of the blade and the hilt.
Do you know the dimensions of the piece?

hoorn178 · 8th August 2007, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David

That is beautiful metal work. I'm not so sure it is Malay though. The patterns look like okir to me. I think this is a Moro piece.

Do you own this kris now? Or have access to it. I would love to see more close-ups, especially of the blade and the hilt.
Do you know the dimensions of the piece?

I have bought it very recently. and I will try to send a close up picture. The hilt is 12 cm and the blade is 30 cm. So total length is about 42 cm.

hoorn178 · 8th August 2007, 06:30 PM

Sorry, still learning how to mail. I have bought it very recently. The hilt is about 12cm and the blade about 30 cm. So the total length is about 42 com. I will tru to mail a close up.

Alam Shah · 8th August 2007, 06:53 PM

I believe it's a Maranao kris, the hilt is a feature. I've seen a similar piece in John's collection. Unfortunately, KampungNet is still not up, yet. Should be able to see it in a a day or two, hopefully.

Battara · 8th August 2007, 07:24 PM

It is Moro alright, and the metal work is okir with gold and silver. I think though it is Sulu and later than WWII. Nice work for recent material. Might be made for a recent wealthy datu (chieftain).

hoorn178 · 8th August 2007, 07:29 PM

The hilt is about 12 cm and the blade about 30 cm so total keris is about 42 cm. Enclosed the best I can do for a close up. I only have a simpel digi camera. Hope you all can tell me more about this keris.

Thanks,

Bart.

kai · 8th August 2007, 08:57 PM

The base of the blade of this kris has many features of a 20th century piece. I wonder wether it might be a bit older than WW2 period though: There seems to be a separate gangya or possibly just an engraved line...

I second the call for more pics, especially close-ups of the base of the blade!

Regards,
Kai

Ian · 8th August 2007, 10:37 PM

I agree with Jose. This seems to be a Sulu style of kris, but I would have a small bet it is Maranao made. The okir work looks very much like the contemporary kris of similar style coming frm two brothers in the Lake Lanao region. The quality of their ornamentation is very high, but the blades are poor quality.

I would check the provenance of this one very carefully. It could well be less than 20 years old. This particular type of small kris is being reproduced very well and could easily deceive a buyer into thinking they have acquired an antique "Sultan's kris" (which is often how they are described).

These contemporary kris will appear more frequently outside the Philippines, as they diffuse into more Western markets. Caveat emptor.

Does anyone else think the hilt on this one looks a little Balinese?

Ian.

Edit: An after thought about the blades on the recently produced Maranao "Sultan's" kris. They are usually etched with acid to give a "watered" appearance and are usually not a laminated construction -- the blade pictured above has the rather mottled appearance of an etched rather than a laminated pattern, but it's hard to tell from pictures. They also usually have an engraved line rather than a truly separate gangya.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

It is Moro alright, and the metal work is okir with gold and silver. I think though it is Sulu and later than WWII. Nice work for recent material. Might be made for a recent wealthy datu (chieftain).

hoorn178 · 9th August 2007, 07:06 AM

I will try to make a close up picture of the base of the blade and will post it this evening (EU time). The gangya seems to be seperate.

Thanks and regards,

Bart.

hoorn178 · 9th August 2007, 12:57 PM

I will try to mail a close up of the blade base. As far as I can see the gangya is seperate.

Thanks,

Bart.

hoorn178 · 9th August 2007, 06:44 PM

Dear all,

I am not able to make a good sharp close up picture with my digi camera

of, among others, the gangya. However when I came home from work I took a very close up and I can see a line but I now doubt the gangya is realy seperate. So perhaps the keris was made somewehere in the late thirties

. That fits with the passing away of the original owner in 1942. Perhaps no antique but still am very happy with my keris since the decorations are very nice and of high quality. It looks really good hanging on my wall next to old black and white pictures of moro sultans and Java nobility

, my two (simple) genuine kerisses from Indonesia and my carved animal skull (see picture).

Many thanks for your imput.
Bart.

8th August 2007, 04:38 PM	#1
hoorn178 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 23	Never seen a keris like this Dear all, Enclosed some pictures of a keris I have seen. I have seen simular flower motives on a antique silver Malay box. It is said that the South Philippine owner of the keris died in 1942 and that it was sold after world war 2 and ended up in Europe. Can anyone tell more?. Thanks in advance. Best regards, Bart. Attached Images

8th August 2007, 06:53 PM	#5
Alam Shah Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,248	Maranao kris I believe it's a Maranao kris, the hilt is a feature. I've seen a similar piece in John's collection. Unfortunately, KampungNet is still not up, yet. Should be able to see it in a a day or two, hopefully.

8th August 2007, 07:29 PM	#7
hoorn178 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 23	close up of blade The hilt is about 12 cm and the blade about 30 cm so total keris is about 42 cm. Enclosed the best I can do for a close up. I only have a simpel digi camera. Hope you all can tell me more about this keris. Thanks, Bart. Attached Images

8th August 2007, 08:57 PM	#8
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,215	The base of the blade of this kris has many features of a 20th century piece. I wonder wether it might be a bit older than WW2 period though: There seems to be a separate gangya or possibly just an engraved line... I second the call for more pics, especially close-ups of the base of the blade! Regards, Kai Last edited by kai; 8th August 2007 at 11:23 PM.

9th August 2007, 07:06 AM	#10
hoorn178 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 23	Never seen keris like this I will try to make a close up picture of the base of the blade and will post it this evening (EU time). The gangya seems to be seperate. Thanks and regards, Bart.

8th August 2007, 06:17 PM	#2
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,024	That is beautiful metal work. I'm not so sure it is Malay though. The patterns look like okir to me. I think this is a Moro piece. Do you own this kris now? Or have access to it. I would love to see more close-ups, especially of the blade and the hilt. Do you know the dimensions of the piece?

8th August 2007, 06:30 PM	#4
hoorn178 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 23	Sorry, still learning how to mail. I have bought it very recently. The hilt is about 12cm and the blade about 30 cm. So the total length is about 42 com. I will tru to mail a close up.

8th August 2007, 07:24 PM	#6
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	It is Moro alright, and the metal work is okir with gold and silver. I think though it is Sulu and later than WWII. Nice work for recent material. Might be made for a recent wealthy datu (chieftain).

9th August 2007, 12:57 PM	#11
hoorn178 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 23	Gangya is seperate I will try to mail a close up of the blade base. As far as I can see the gangya is seperate. Thanks, Bart.

9th August 2007, 06:44 PM	#12
hoorn178 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 23	Not able to make good picture Dear all, I am not able to make a good sharp close up picture with my digi camera of, among others, the gangya. However when I came home from work I took a very close up and I can see a line but I now doubt the gangya is realy seperate. So perhaps the keris was made somewehere in the late thirties . That fits with the passing away of the original owner in 1942. Perhaps no antique but still am very happy with my keris since the decorations are very nice and of high quality. It looks really good hanging on my wall next to old black and white pictures of moro sultans and Java nobility , my two (simple) genuine kerisses from Indonesia and my carved animal skull (see picture). Many thanks for your imput. Bart. Attached Images