Balkan Yataghan with Silver and Coral

Battara · 2nd December 2010, 02:58 AM

Greetings folks! Yet another yat I got from Oriental-Arms. I cleaned it up and did a little trimming around the torn bottom of the upper silver chape. The scabbard mounts are silver done in repousse and blue velvet. The upper chape has coral and dark green glass stones.

The hilt is silver with filigree, corals, and a couple of silver niello plaques.

As far as the blade is concerned, it is earlier and there are remnants of gold koftgari on both sides. Unfortunately the inscription on the one side is the best of the two and is barely visible. According to Artzi, the blade is older than the rest of the piece.

One other thing. According to Elgood in his recent book on The Arms of Greece and her Balkan Neighbors in the Ottoman Period, this piece is from Focha, Bosnia.

I need help with translating the inscription if possible (please Zifir?

).

Enjoy!

Battara · 2nd December 2010, 02:58 AM

And more........

Battara · 2nd December 2010, 03:00 AM

Here are two pictures of the gold koftgari inscription that I need translated:

TVV · 2nd December 2010, 07:52 AM

Very nice yataghan Jose, congratulations. I have nothing to add, except that I think that during the time the yataghan was made, Foca was in the Herzegovina sanjak, rather than in the Bosnia sanjak of the Ottoman Empire. While Elgood shows two examples with writing on them expressly mentioning that they were mounted in Foca, I would guess the style was popular in Herzegovina and Montenegro, and quite certainly in parts of Bosnia and Serbia.

Regards,
Teodor

Zifir · 2nd December 2010, 11:36 AM

Hi Battara,
Unfortunately, we, translators, are too much concerned about the artistic quality of your pictures, especially the ones of scripts.

Seriously, it is very difficult to read the script from these pictures.

Amel-i El-hac Muhammed Sahib Osman...then it becomes really blurred

Spunjer · 2nd December 2010, 05:00 PM

Yowza! Now that's a sword! Never seen a sword with so much silver work! Beautiful, and congrats! My question is on swords like this, is it kosher to highly polish the blade ala katana style, since it looks as if the rest of it is shiny anyways?

Battara · 2nd December 2010, 10:20 PM

Thank you folks! I love it!

Ron - good question. I have not polished it yet, so I don't know.

Zifir - this is the best I can do at the moment - it is so worn. I guess the owner is Osman and the maker Mohammed? If I can come up with some other way to get a better script to you I will.

TVV - I have seen other pieces from Focha and they too have this amount, style and quality of silver work. That being said, I would not be surprised if the surrounding areas liked this style too. You have a good point. I have seen a bichaq from Montenegro with similar silver work as well......

CharlesS · 3rd December 2010, 12:15 AM

Glad you got this Jose...I know one of this type had been on the wish list for a long time! Congrats!

Battara · 3rd December 2010, 02:41 AM

After the prices I had seen ($7000

) I almost gave up. This may not be worth that much (or not any more with the recession) but I still was barely able to afford this one. As Vandoo once said, I will be eating beans and rice for a long time.

Robert · 3rd December 2010, 04:15 AM

Personally, I like beans (red or black) and rice.

Not too high a price to pay at all for an item of this quality as far as I'm concerned. It's just too bad the wife doesn't seem to look at it in the same way.

A great new addition to your collection!!!(this is where we need a jealousy icon) Does this mean that I will be having a little less competition on some of the Philippine items now that you're into collecting yataghans?

Robert

Battara · 3rd December 2010, 04:47 PM

Funny Robert, funny.......

Battara · 13th December 2010, 08:05 PM

Zifir, would this picture be more helpful in translation? (played with several fiiters):

kino · 13th December 2010, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Coleman

A great new addition to your collection!!!(this is where we need a jealousy icon) Does this mean that I will be having a little less competition on some of the Philippine items now that you're into collecting yataghans?

Robert

Funny how you now have 2 Yatagans (as far as I know), and Spunjer just recently posted one of his own. What is this world coming to

Battara · 14th December 2010, 03:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kino

Funny how you now have 2 Yatagans (as far as I know), and Spunjer just recently posted one of his own. What is this world coming to

Spunjer · 14th December 2010, 04:15 AM

Actually you started the trend, brah! You posted that barung with a yat in the background, and all of a sudden i started having this urge to add a yat in my arsenal... but hey, if someone wanna trade a complete silver junggayan kris like the one artzi have in his gallery, i'll be more than happy to go all moro once again

Battara · 14th December 2010, 11:32 PM

Well, glad to help Spunger.

And Kino, if you want to talk theology, I'm game (lots of seminary training

).

Here is a display of my humble and meager Ottoman collection:

TVV · 15th December 2010, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Battara

my humble and meager Ottoman collection:

Jose, you have just redefined the meaning of "humble and meger". Those are two words I certainly would not use when referring to your collection.

Battara · 15th December 2010, 04:18 AM

Thank you Theodor.......you are very kind.......

2nd December 2010, 02:58 AM	#1
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Balkan Yataghan with Silver and Coral Greetings folks! Yet another yat I got from Oriental-Arms. I cleaned it up and did a little trimming around the torn bottom of the upper silver chape. The scabbard mounts are silver done in repousse and blue velvet. The upper chape has coral and dark green glass stones. The hilt is silver with filigree, corals, and a couple of silver niello plaques. As far as the blade is concerned, it is earlier and there are remnants of gold koftgari on both sides. Unfortunately the inscription on the one side is the best of the two and is barely visible. According to Artzi, the blade is older than the rest of the piece. One other thing. According to Elgood in his recent book on The Arms of Greece and her Balkan Neighbors in the Ottoman Period, this piece is from Focha, Bosnia. I need help with translating the inscription if possible (please Zifir? ). Enjoy! Attached Images Last edited by Battara; 2nd December 2010 at 03:21 AM.

2nd December 2010, 02:58 AM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	And more........ Attached Images

2nd December 2010, 03:00 AM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Here are two pictures of the gold koftgari inscription that I need translated: Attached Images

13th December 2010, 08:05 PM	#12
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Zifir, would this picture be more helpful in translation? (played with several fiiters): Attached Images

14th December 2010, 11:32 PM	#16
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Well, glad to help Spunger. And Kino, if you want to talk theology, I'm game (lots of seminary training ). Here is a display of my humble and meager Ottoman collection: Attached Images

2nd December 2010, 07:52 AM	#4
TVV Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Bay Area Posts: 1,599	Very nice yataghan Jose, congratulations. I have nothing to add, except that I think that during the time the yataghan was made, Foca was in the Herzegovina sanjak, rather than in the Bosnia sanjak of the Ottoman Empire. While Elgood shows two examples with writing on them expressly mentioning that they were mounted in Foca, I would guess the style was popular in Herzegovina and Montenegro, and quite certainly in parts of Bosnia and Serbia. Regards, Teodor

2nd December 2010, 11:36 AM	#5
Zifir Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Istanbul Posts: 228	Hi Battara, Unfortunately, we, translators, are too much concerned about the artistic quality of your pictures, especially the ones of scripts. Seriously, it is very difficult to read the script from these pictures. Amel-i El-hac Muhammed Sahib Osman...then it becomes really blurred

2nd December 2010, 05:00 PM	#6
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Yowza! Now that's a sword! Never seen a sword with so much silver work! Beautiful, and congrats! My question is on swords like this, is it kosher to highly polish the blade ala katana style, since it looks as if the rest of it is shiny anyways?

2nd December 2010, 10:20 PM	#7
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Thank you folks! I love it! Ron - good question. I have not polished it yet, so I don't know. Zifir - this is the best I can do at the moment - it is so worn. I guess the owner is Osman and the maker Mohammed? If I can come up with some other way to get a better script to you I will. TVV - I have seen other pieces from Focha and they too have this amount, style and quality of silver work. That being said, I would not be surprised if the surrounding areas liked this style too. You have a good point. I have seen a bichaq from Montenegro with similar silver work as well......

3rd December 2010, 12:15 AM	#8
CharlesS Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Greenville, NC Posts: 1,855	Glad you got this Jose...I know one of this type had been on the wish list for a long time! Congrats!

3rd December 2010, 02:41 AM	#9
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	After the prices I had seen ($7000 ) I almost gave up. This may not be worth that much (or not any more with the recession) but I still was barely able to afford this one. As Vandoo once said, I will be eating beans and rice for a long time.

3rd December 2010, 04:15 AM	#10
Robert EAAF Staff Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Centerville, Kansas Posts: 2,196	Personally, I like beans (red or black) and rice. Not too high a price to pay at all for an item of this quality as far as I'm concerned. It's just too bad the wife doesn't seem to look at it in the same way. A great new addition to your collection!!!(this is where we need a jealousy icon) Does this mean that I will be having a little less competition on some of the Philippine items now that you're into collecting yataghans? Robert

3rd December 2010, 04:47 PM	#11
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Funny Robert, funny.......

14th December 2010, 04:15 AM	#15
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	Actually you started the trend, brah! You posted that barung with a yat in the background, and all of a sudden i started having this urge to add a yat in my arsenal... but hey, if someone wanna trade a complete silver junggayan kris like the one artzi have in his gallery, i'll be more than happy to go all moro once again

15th December 2010, 04:18 AM	#18
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,139	Thank you Theodor.......you are very kind.......