Guns and Camels

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 22nd August 2016, 11:39 AM

I thought to begin recording Guns and Camel pictures thus ~

One interesting fact I have unearthed is~ Unlike other empires and armies, the Mughals used large elephants and camels for their cavalry.

Horses were still used by the Mughals in their cavalry. Like the soldiers, animals were also armored on most of their bodies. Some camels even had guns mounted on them. The zamburak, for example, was a camel with a mounted swivel gun upon its back.

I placed another thread on http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21529 however that deals with artillery / small cannon mounted on Camels ...whereas this one is rifles either of the Camel gun/Jezail designation or Martini Henry etc etc...

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 23rd August 2016, 12:19 PM

kronckew · 23rd August 2016, 07:15 PM

US Army Camel Corps

See This ref.: http://theblogofteresa.com/us-camel-corps/

it did not turn out well, having been an idea of jefferson davis' pre civil war, it was disbanded after the war...

quote from ref:

"The route taken to Fort Tejon passed through lands controlled by the Mojave Indians who often attacked civilian transports, but avoided any military soldiers. As Bishop was now a civilian and the camel experiment was now officially a civilian experiment, no soldiers were with the camel and during one such trip a large force of Mojave Indians threatened Bishop’s men. Bishop ordered them to mount the camels and charge the attackers. The surprise charge of the men on such strange beasts did in fact rout the Mojave Indians and went down in history as probably the only camel charge in the west, which ironically was performed by civilians as opposed to the military."

hollywood even immortalised them in a 1976 movie: Hawmps

Kubur · 18th October 2016, 08:00 PM

Just for you Ibrahem...
A camel mounted gatling gun
Poor camel no need to go to the hairdresser after that...
Best,
Kubur

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 19th October 2016, 04:50 PM

I assume there is a picture ?

kronckew · 19th October 2016, 07:00 PM

it must be wearing camouflage.

Kubur · 19th October 2016, 07:12 PM

Oh guys iwas born before computers!!

kronckew · 19th October 2016, 07:44 PM

me too!, well, unless you count that ww2 thing at bletchly park that took vacuum tubes and needed a huge power station's worth of juice to run it and was constantly crashing as the tubes burned out. in that one a computer bug usually was a real insect stuck in a relay.

Bob A · 19th October 2016, 08:54 PM

fernando · 19th October 2016, 09:49 PM

Very impressive but rather unreal, maybe ?. Wait till those guys in the back start shooting their gatlings all in a row and those camelidae start jumping with panic and run the hell out of the battle field

.

kronckew · 20th October 2016, 08:04 AM

i recall seeing moroccan camel mounted warriors charging across a field during a celebration and suddenly firing their jezails very smokily into the air. didn't seem to phase the camels at all. they get used to it in training (or get eaten if they don't).

anyway, looking for a video of this (i failed to find one) i found this photo from an aussie war memorial site, it's from the imperial camel corps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07JGpardvLU

also see https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/F00042/

it has a section where the guns carried by the camels are re-assembled and mounted on carriages and fired. the two-part barrels are interesting. they appear to be breech loaders too. starts at 01:42-ish

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 20th October 2016, 05:16 PM

Please see http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21529 where I did camels and heavy guns.

fernando · 20th October 2016, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

i recall seeing moroccan camel mounted warriors charging across a field during a celebration and suddenly firing their jezails very smokily into the air. didn't seem to phase the camels at all. they get used to it in training ...

I guess i had a different perspective; one in that a dozen camel riders cracking their jezails in a fantasia is rather distinct from a camel platoon thundering with their gatlings. My comprehension was that camels were practical to carry heavy guns, but not shooting whilst advancing on the field.
But then, one is always learning

.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 21st October 2016, 12:25 AM

No evidence exists of firing any weapon other than a rifle from a standing camel. The camel when crouched on the ground was a different matter though the best solution was a fully dismounted one.

fernando · 21st October 2016, 11:07 AM

As i realized.

Andreas · 22nd October 2016, 08:38 AM

Another two.

Ibrahiim al Balooshi · 22nd October 2016, 09:17 PM

Please see http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21529

Andreas · 23rd October 2016, 08:02 AM

And here's a Camel not with one but two machine guns!

(Sorry, couldn't resist).

kronckew · 23rd October 2016, 08:23 AM

hmmm, one wing would be dromedary, two must therefore be bactrian. poor thing is missing one rear leg completely and only has one poor shrivelled one back there that appears to be missing it's foot. no wonder they are called 'tail draggers'. probably can't carry much of a load either. their main advantage was being able to swim in 3d in that gaseous fluid we call 'air'.

they were however famous for not needing anywhere near as much water as a mammalian camel, but did drink a lot of petroleum product, and had a fondness for spitting castor oil in it's rider's face. the secret rarely mentioned malady of ww1 pilots was their perpetual diarrhoea

22nd August 2016, 11:39 AM	#1
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Guns and Camels I thought to begin recording Guns and Camel pictures thus ~ One interesting fact I have unearthed is~ Unlike other empires and armies, the Mughals used large elephants and camels for their cavalry. Horses were still used by the Mughals in their cavalry. Like the soldiers, animals were also armored on most of their bodies. Some camels even had guns mounted on them. The zamburak, for example, was a camel with a mounted swivel gun upon its back. I placed another thread on http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21529 however that deals with artillery / small cannon mounted on Camels ...whereas this one is rifles either of the Camel gun/Jezail designation or Martini Henry etc etc... Attached Images Last edited by Ibrahiim al Balooshi; 22nd August 2016 at 03:23 PM.

23rd August 2016, 12:19 PM	#2
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Attached Images

23rd August 2016, 07:15 PM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	US Army Camel Corps See This ref.: http://theblogofteresa.com/us-camel-corps/ it did not turn out well, having been an idea of jefferson davis' pre civil war, it was disbanded after the war... quote from ref: "The route taken to Fort Tejon passed through lands controlled by the Mojave Indians who often attacked civilian transports, but avoided any military soldiers. As Bishop was now a civilian and the camel experiment was now officially a civilian experiment, no soldiers were with the camel and during one such trip a large force of Mojave Indians threatened Bishop’s men. Bishop ordered them to mount the camels and charge the attackers. The surprise charge of the men on such strange beasts did in fact rout the Mojave Indians and went down in history as probably the only camel charge in the west, which ironically was performed by civilians as opposed to the military." hollywood even immortalised them in a 1976 movie: Hawmps Attached Images Last edited by kronckew; 23rd August 2016 at 07:39 PM.

19th October 2016, 07:12 PM	#7
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Oh guys iwas born before computers!! Attached Images

20th October 2016, 08:04 AM	#11
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	i recall seeing moroccan camel mounted warriors charging across a field during a celebration and suddenly firing their jezails very smokily into the air. didn't seem to phase the camels at all. they get used to it in training (or get eaten if they don't). anyway, looking for a video of this (i failed to find one) i found this photo from an aussie war memorial site, it's from the imperial camel corps. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07JGpardvLU also see https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/F00042/ it has a section where the guns carried by the camels are re-assembled and mounted on carriages and fired. the two-part barrels are interesting. they appear to be breech loaders too. starts at 01:42-ish Attached Images Last edited by kronckew; 20th October 2016 at 08:22 AM.

18th October 2016, 08:00 PM	#4
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Just for you Ibrahem... A camel mounted gatling gun Poor camel no need to go to the hairdresser after that... Best, Kubur

19th October 2016, 04:50 PM	#5
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	I assume there is a picture ?

19th October 2016, 07:00 PM	#6
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	it must be wearing camouflage.

19th October 2016, 07:44 PM	#8
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	me too!, well, unless you count that ww2 thing at bletchly park that took vacuum tubes and needed a huge power station's worth of juice to run it and was constantly crashing as the tubes burned out. in that one a computer bug usually was a real insect stuck in a relay.

19th October 2016, 08:54 PM	#9
Bob A Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 409

19th October 2016, 09:49 PM	#10
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,637	Very impressive but rather unreal, maybe ?. Wait till those guys in the back start shooting their gatlings all in a row and those camelidae start jumping with panic and run the hell out of the battle field .

20th October 2016, 05:16 PM	#12
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Please see http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21529 where I did camels and heavy guns.

21st October 2016, 12:25 AM	#14
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	No evidence exists of firing any weapon other than a rifle from a standing camel. The camel when crouched on the ground was a different matter though the best solution was a fully dismounted one.

21st October 2016, 11:07 AM	#15
fernando Lead Moderator European Armoury Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,637	As i realized.

22nd October 2016, 08:38 AM	#16
Andreas Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Ionian Islands, Greece Posts: 96	Another two. Attached Images

22nd October 2016, 09:17 PM	#17
Ibrahiim al Balooshi Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE Posts: 4,408	Please see http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=21529

23rd October 2016, 08:02 AM	#18
Andreas Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Ionian Islands, Greece Posts: 96	And here's a Camel not with one but two machine guns! (Sorry, couldn't resist). Attached Images

23rd October 2016, 08:23 AM	#19
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,150	hmmm, one wing would be dromedary, two must therefore be bactrian. poor thing is missing one rear leg completely and only has one poor shrivelled one back there that appears to be missing it's foot. no wonder they are called 'tail draggers'. probably can't carry much of a load either. their main advantage was being able to swim in 3d in that gaseous fluid we call 'air'. they were however famous for not needing anywhere near as much water as a mammalian camel, but did drink a lot of petroleum product, and had a fondness for spitting castor oil in it's rider's face. the secret rarely mentioned malady of ww1 pilots was their perpetual diarrhoea