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Old 15th November 2010, 01:48 AM   #31
migueldiaz
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Another pic ...
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Old 15th November 2010, 01:50 AM   #32
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Here's a GI who apparently had seen action all over the Philippines ...
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Old 15th November 2010, 03:06 AM   #33
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Yes what drives me nuts about these pictures is the false coloring! I will even photocopy these in black and white to try to bring them back to reality for study.

Now that my rant is over, thank you for the close ups!
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Old 15th November 2010, 03:41 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Battara
Yes what drives me nuts about these pictures is the false coloring! I will even photocopy these in black and white to try to bring them back to reality for study.
Whew! Thanks. So those Moros did not wear pink pants after all

If you are using Windows, Irfanview is a free app that can easily convert to greyscale any color photo (among many other tricks up its sleeves).
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Old 15th November 2010, 03:45 AM   #35
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Thanks may try that it (hope it works on a Mac! ).
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Old 15th November 2010, 06:03 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Battara
Thanks may try that it (hope it works on a Mac! ).
I use a Mac, too. In that case it'll be even easier. Open the pic in iPhoto, and then click "Effects", as illustrated
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Old 15th November 2010, 04:03 PM   #37
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Salamat Po Bro!
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Old 15th November 2010, 04:46 PM   #38
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Thumbs up Most interesting images ... thank you!

Photoshop attempt:
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Old 16th November 2010, 04:40 PM   #39
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It turned out that I was only about halfway in separating the components when I made my last post. It turned out there was a deep vein of epoxy still binding tang to wood and the silver foil sleeve. An eight hour soak in methyl ethyl ketone (MEK) would penetrate and soften about a millimeter thickness of the epoxy with further softening not observed from a longer soak. The weakened epoxy could then be scraped away with a dissecting needle and the cycle repeated for days. The old tar-like material, still tacky in places, but mostly dried, originally securing the blade in place was much more vulnerable to the MEK and the tang finally released. Soaking of the wood and silver continued until I could no longer reach the remaining epoxy between the silver and the wood. At this point I gave it a bit of time to dry and applied heat with a kitchen stove-top burner. The MEK residue still lit a couple of times. Finally the remaining epoxy failed and I got the silver tube free from the remains of the shaft. The silver tube went off to Battara and I suspect he had been expecting something more substantial - this silver was really more a silver foil - thicker than kitchen aluminum foil but not nearly as thick as the wall of a typical food can. The torn areas were a bit too distorted for recovery, so we decided to sacrifice about an inch of this area as the design was in a helix and repeated.

In due course I hope to get this on a pole, leaving a hidden backing of copper seamless tube beneath the silver sleeve. It is nice to have gotten the wood out reasonably intact to see how the blade was mounted - the tarry substance was doing most of the work - unfortunately, the wood is unlikely to provide further clues of its origin.
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Old 16th November 2010, 08:10 PM   #40
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I believe the third man from the right in the group picture posted above holds a spear with a similar head to Lee's example .

Good patient job with the MEK Lee .





I'll pray for your Liver ...
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Old 16th November 2010, 10:42 PM   #41
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Hello, Lee. As an aside, I've always liked looking at the pics you take, as they show subtle details. Do you use artificial lighting, or are the pics taken on an overcast day? Hope you can give us a tip or two Thanks in advance.
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Old 17th November 2010, 12:39 AM   #42
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Great post Lee,

The step by step process you followed is quite interesting and the image is great, that new camera really is a good one!

Unlike the Moro Spear I presented that has a long brass/bronze collar to support the tang and head, I found it very informative to know how thin the silver collar was on this piece, nothing more than decoration and a cylinder shaft to contain the resin when initially made...

It just goes to show, a little time and thought, some good specialist help with the silver and a cleaning of the steel brings with it rewards very satisfying. This approach can be applied to any weapon in these pages that wants or needs to be enhanced, repaired or restored.

The new wood shaft should prove interesting too. Do you have resources to have a full length new one made? I know I would be happy to provide details of width and taper. From there you could aquire what you need to cast and complete the butt cap and then have a complete representative example of a wonderful weapon.

Great work.

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Old 17th November 2010, 02:56 AM   #43
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Greetings Folks!

Lee asked me if I would comment on my end of the silver work. Here is a quick synopsis of what I did:

Well, when I got it, as Lee said, I thought it would be thicker stuff. However, it found it to be almost literally paper thin (no kidding!). This in itself presented a problem in trying to braze sections together - they would melt!

The area that was torn in half was not only too thin, but the metal was warped and stretched. No way to pull it all together without melting, and if I were by some miracle able to, the sleeve would bend over. Instead we decided to cut the parts and I soft soldered them together, covering over the area with the original intact ring.

One of the rings was also in this kind of shape. In this case, however, I had to make an entirely new one from scratch. The silver I used was a little thicker so that I could braze it properly as well as use a dapping block and mandrels to give the ring some semblance of curvature on the sides. I also incised lines on the outside of the ring to match the others.

Another thing I had to do was to reshape the top and bottom of the piece - they were dented and misshapen. This includes reshaping the bottom ring. Lots of hammering and re-hammering on different mandrels.

Finally I took off all the dirt and corrosion. I gave it several levels of buffing and polishing to get rid of all the 100 years of oxidation. This brought it back to life the way it was meant to be.

There you have it. More work than I was expecting, but well worth it. Very pleased to do it.
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Old 20th November 2010, 09:48 PM   #44
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Rick - Indeed, thank you for pointing this out, I do see the similarity in the dominant central mid-rib on that spear in the photograph kindly posted by Migueldiaz, although I suspect the base may be round. (I also find it interesting to note the spears carried by the adjacent man to the right and also the second from the left have the assisting wire or cord as a backup for securing the blade to the shaft.) (I did the MEK work in the garage with the main door open and the container mouth covered with aluminum foil or a cap.)

These old pictures do show us that a number of different spear styles were in use concurrently. Looking at the spear first presented in this thread with the tang now exposed, there is considerable old brown rust patina on the tang. There was no evidence of active red rust or rusty flakes in the socket, the tarry material had done its job very well. Similarly, the other spear I presented had a good coat of old rust on its bare tang while the blade had remained reasonably bright - so indeed it was not a new spearhead in 1907. I am beginning to wonder just how old some of these spearheads are. There obviously was significant trade throughout the region and older spearheads continuing in use beside new ones.

Migueldiaz - thank you for your kind comment on the photos. Most of the credit has to go to the new Canon camera I bought this summer to replace my old once respectable 2.4 megapixel unit that now lags behind the average phone in image quality. I have been shooting these outside on overcast days. As it snowed here a few nights ago, that is not going to work much longer this year, so I will have to try to set up some indoor lighting, please wish me luck.

Gavin - thank you also for your kind comments. While the silver ferrule sleeve is most attractive, even in dim light from across the room, it is pretty obvious that it was not providing much structural support. I do not know if it made a difference that the socket went deeper than the tang, but clearly the shaft had failed just beyond the tang. The wire on Emanuel's example makes a lot more sense. Perhaps this spear's mounting was adequate and was just abused, causing the failure. I am still looking around for potential pole material; for now the silver sleeve is underlain by a seamless copper tube and a temporary dowel provides a socket for the tang. Would oak have been used for these poles or was another wood favored?
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Old 20th November 2010, 11:15 PM   #45
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Most likely narra wood wood would have been use, perhaps the outside of the narra tree. Problem is that it is no longer exported since it is becoming endangered. I would suggest walnut (looking like the outside of the narra tree) or dark stained padauk wood. Walnut would be easier and cheaper. Or you could just stain wood in walnut stain. My question would be did it have a bottom to it or not? If so, what kind?
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Old 20th November 2010, 11:22 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
Would oak have been used for these poles or was another wood favored?


Lee, whilst I am not versed in the correct timbers used in native surrounds, something sits in the memory banks that this was discussed some time back and Lew from memory or a thread that Lew took part in mentioned the timbers strong enough for the purpose and I think maybe where to get them from too.

Edit; There ya go Battara got in first.

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Old 26th November 2010, 01:50 AM   #47
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Lee, thank you, too.

Attached are some more pics of various Philippine swords, some of which are Moro. Thanks.
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Old 26th November 2010, 08:05 AM   #48
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Here's some more pics, from Museo Naval in Spain ...
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Old 26th November 2010, 08:12 AM   #49
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More pics from Madrid's Museo Naval ...
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Old 28th November 2010, 02:42 AM   #50
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Looking at this again I just noticed that there are a couple of spears that are in a similar condition to Lee's - torn brass or silver sleeves.
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Old 28th November 2010, 08:30 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by migueldiaz

Attached are some more pics of various Philippine swords, some of which are Moro. Thanks.

The spear in the middle seem to have a similarity with the captain Chimmo budiak.
They both seem to have the same decoration band of swags carved at the wooden shaft, right below the brass socket.

Maurice
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Old 9th July 2019, 03:31 PM   #52
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Cool Technical details

The contrast within the twist core pattern-welding of the budiak that this thread started with appears to have been enhanced by a small percentage of Nickel. X-Ray fluorescence analysis (so, surface averaged over an area of about a square centimeter) disclosed about half of one percent Nickel without other elements commonly used to enhance patterns. Perhaps, in this context, a meteoric origin might be suspected, but there was not strong technical evidence for this. The silver sleeve is of good grade, about 90 percent, with trace elements consistent with early 20th century or before.
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Old 9th July 2019, 05:24 PM   #53
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Hello Lee,

Thanks for your insights - I hope more of these data will get reported with the XRF technology becoming more and more available!

Could you make the full lists available, please? Always difficult to anticipate what may prove important later on...

The low level of nickel is to be expected and certainly does not indicate any meteorite content: Sourcing this iron from Luwu (or some other terrestrial origin) seems much more likely unless you hit any characteristic trace metal fingerprint.

Regards,
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Old 7th November 2019, 11:03 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
So, ironically, the protobudiak gets to be the reference point as I pull something from the opposite side of the globe and a millennium further back out of the armoury to compare with it, namely a mid to late Viking Age (Carolingian) winged spearhead. The big, obvious differences are that the winged spearhead is socketed (with two small protrusions or 'wings' arising from the socket) and the tanged protobudiak has more pronounced fullering. In functional impact, however, these two spearheads are nearly identical in length (protobudiak 355 mm; winged spearhead 345 mm - measuring from where each blade begins to expand out from neck to the tip) and in mass (protobudiak as pictured including partial mounts and epoxy 469 grams; winged spearhead 409 grams with some losses from the socket on the opposite side).


I recently received delivery of a similar Type D Viking Age spearhead. I was eager to see if it had pattern welding. The core seems to be pattern-welded, though it could also be some clever texturing, but it is consistent on both sides of the spear (see the contrasty, filtered images).

But when I held it in my hand, I was similarly struck by its similarities to a budiak spearhead that I had purchased earlier in the year. Their silhouettes are almost identical (from neck to tip), and they share the aesthetic of core pattern-welding. I haven't weighed them, but they have a similar heft. It's fascinating that cultures a world and a millennium apart made such similar design decisions on their spears.

(I promise to try to get better at taking pictures of my weapons...)
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Old 7th November 2019, 11:55 PM   #55
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Thumbs up Nice, very nice!

Two very, very nice spearheads.

The early winged one appears to definitely have one band of pattern-welding. If the meandering side to side is the 'mirror image' on the back side, then this likely results from one twisted rod also forming a core, and I suspect this is the case as the plane of the surface appears to be intersecting at the periphery of a twisted rod. I include an image from Lorange (1889) showing some similar patterns.

The budiak appears to have two bands well controlled and corresponding to the mirrored chiseled out panels either side of the midrib. Here the intersection is much deeper, even to mid rod. The pattern-welded budiaks that I have been fortunate enough to acquire are either like the one at the head of this thread or have a single relatively flat central panel without the midrib.

The similarity in shape and size of these spearheads coming from such different origins does suggest these must be well proven and effective proportions.
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